Rumor has it Wood is politicking hard to be in the lower division of the Catholic League. In essence, to avoid playing Prep & Lasalle. Smart move by Devlin, or could be interpreted as him ducking Lasalle and Wood for the fear of not making PIAA playoffs with losses to Prep and Lasalle year in, year out, and a loss to one of the national schedule programs Wood is now involved in. With all the added programs now recruiting public school kids, IMHOPTEP, Neumann, I think Devlin might be wondering if he can recruit the top notch players he once was able to get a few years ago. I can't imagine the McDevitt's, Egan's, and Carroll's of the world would agree to this. Stay tuned
Wood to Lower Division in PCL???
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How are they politicking hard for this? Their numbers are what they are. They will be in a designated class determined by enrollment. Depending on the the new numbers, the PCL will adjust their league set-up. No guarantee there is a Red/Blue set-up for the next two-year cycle. It could just as easily go back to classification set-up like in the past.
Not sure a buy the avoiding the SJP/LS theory. They have been very competitive with each over time. In the past, AW's N-L schedule could be questioned, but this year that all changed. The way the system is set-up you can play competitive schedule, lose 2-3 games, and still be in play for a state title run. Wood/LS and Wood/SJP as of now are great match-ups for the PCL. And quite frankly, these games should be insisted on being played by the people who run the league.
Someone made reference in another thread that Carrol is moving down too. Not sure if that is accurate. or was a request or simply by the numbers? I thought the Red/Blue was truly based upon enrollment, not competitive balance. So, if in fact Carroll & Wood move down, which 2 teams move up?
I'm pretty sure the enrollment numbers for the next two-year cycle have to be submitted before the end of this month. Where a program could politic is how the league configures itself. For example, hey how about we go to classification divisions instead of a Red/Blue set-up where the top 7 are in the Red and bottom seven in Blue. IMO, if they were to go to classification divisions again, then you're going to have scheduling issues. Plus, their were only four classes when they did that before. Now, it's six. Can't have a two-team division.
Agreed Huck, but last year's Wood's scheduled included Wayne and Bergen so that is when we saw the change to the weaker non conferrence games. Wood could lose to prep and lasalle and all non conference games and still play ryan and carroll for 5A playoffs and go to hershey. So that argument makes no sense. While LS has about 1100 boys, Prep has about 1000, and Wood has about 500 boys grades 9-12, Wood beat lasalle last 2 years and prep game has proven a great challenge for wood. You don't schedule Oxbridge now ranked 18t in Fla, Paramus Cath, Bergen Cath #1 in NJ again with convincing win over St. Peter's prep, and duck Prep and Lasalle. I have no idea what goes on behind closed doors but the logic for that rumor seems unfounded.
The PIAA cycle ends in June, 2018. Per the website, the 2 smallest schools in the Red Division are Carroll ( 431 boys grades 10-12) and Wood( 425). The 2 biggest in the small division Blue are Ohara ( 390) and Bonner ( 339). Those would really be the only 4 schools in play based upon numbers. So it would require about a 50 boy swing up/down to move into a higher/lower division. I am not a PCL guy, so is it possible to see a swing like that over a 2 year period?
Also, Roman has about 150 more boys than St . Joes. I was surprised at that number.
Also, Roman has about 150 more boys than St . Joes. I was surprised at that number.
I have never heard of such a rule.
Schools can't drop down. They can only play up.
Deadline to submit enrollment numbers is today. Schools will get a report in early Novemeber and then have one month to stay where they are or move up classes.
It's always been grades 9-11, so in year 2 of the cycle those kids are in 10-12.
To the OP, there's no reason for Wood to worry about not making the playoffs. All the PCL big schools qualify for the post-season.
Burrs yes, the rule I had heard about had something to do with being forced to play UP a class, not down. Now again I could be mistaken on this, or I could have a bad source, but it was my understanding that if a team were to win 2 state championships at their level they would then be moved up a classification at the next 2 year interval. For example if Wood were to win again and have 2016 and 2017 championships, they would then have to play in the 6A PIAA playoffs in 2018 and 2019.
FJ
That was a discussion and maybe even a proposal, but was not put into policy as of yet to my knowledge. Not a bad proposal, other than where do you put Prep, if they win back to back, DIII?
This. Not a rule. Was discussed, but never passed.
I think we may be mixing apples and oranges. The PIAA uses the enrollment numbers statewide to determine what class you compete (6A, 5A, etc ). You must compete in that class or ABOVE, you can never opt to play down. So if Wood is 5A, they can stay 5A or play up at 6A. I know of no rule that orders a team to move up based upon championships won.
Locally , I believe the PCL also uses the same numbers to determine Red/Blue divisions. The 7 biggest schools Red, 7 small schools Blue. So I don't think it's a matter of wanting to move up/down. The numbers determine that. So in order for Wood and/ or Carroll to move down , Ohara and Bonner would have to have more kids and they would move up.
Locally , I believe the PCL also uses the same numbers to determine Red/Blue divisions. The 7 biggest schools Red, 7 small schools Blue. So I don't think it's a matter of wanting to move up/down. The numbers determine that. So in order for Wood and/ or Carroll to move down , Ohara and Bonner would have to have more kids and they would move up.
The real question for Wood is when will Devlin decide to move up to 6A. That’s where the States best football is played and 5A is the weakest division out of all 6 in Pa. Where’s the challenge? Playing Academy Park ? Really ? Whitehall w 4 loses in the last years Eastern Finals ? Really ? Quite boring to not win the catholic league and yet then play extremely weak teams. When do you get tired of beating teams that on paper have little or no chance. Devlin is a good coach who if he aspire’s to be the best has to beat the best.... well InFante, Beck, and a slew of the State’s other great coaches are waiting
I think it's safe to say that they're not moving up anytime soon. I'm fairly sure that the league likes spreading their teams around and having a chance to win at multiple levels. Saying the 5A level is the weakest is a bit harsh, IMO. Furthermore, this is only year two of the new six class set-up. AW was 3A prior to this and the competition there was always good. Why should they have to move up? Hey, if they have that urge then go for it, but calling them out for not doing it isn't right.
And if AW gets a state title this year then they would have beaten a really, really, really good Harrisburg team in doing so. I'd like to see Springfield win the D-1 5A this year go against AW. I think that might be interesting.
Speed it's not a top seven go here and next seven go there situation. If Carroll, Ryan Wood meet the classifications of 4a and do not choose to move up to 5a they will need a schedule where they play the other 4a teams in O'Hara and Bonner.
So unless League says you can't move down and have to play 5a there is a chance Wood, Carroll, Ryan all become 4a with O'Hara and Bonner. It's not District 1 so teams need to play and playoff to determine who moves on in District 12. Right now the 7/7 format works because 7 are 6a and 5a and rest are 4a or below.
No way a Carroll or Ryan going to accept being forced to stay at 5a to keep 7/7 conference alignment.
Best guess is some hybrid crossover schedule with bigs playing some littles and then playing off inside your classifications. This will be it for Red and Blue. Probably going to be ugly with problems at varsity level and a calamity at jv and freshmen. Going to be 6a and 5a play each other crossover with two fours and a low. Or play all in classification rest by geography. We will see but Carroll will be 4a. Numbers down there. Last classification Wood was smallest of 5a in D12 so they could be 4a.
So unless League says you can't move down and have to play 5a there is a chance Wood, Carroll, Ryan all become 4a with O'Hara and Bonner. It's not District 1 so teams need to play and playoff to determine who moves on in District 12. Right now the 7/7 format works because 7 are 6a and 5a and rest are 4a or below.
No way a Carroll or Ryan going to accept being forced to stay at 5a to keep 7/7 conference alignment.
Best guess is some hybrid crossover schedule with bigs playing some littles and then playing off inside your classifications. This will be it for Red and Blue. Probably going to be ugly with problems at varsity level and a calamity at jv and freshmen. Going to be 6a and 5a play each other crossover with two fours and a low. Or play all in classification rest by geography. We will see but Carroll will be 4a. Numbers down there. Last classification Wood was smallest of 5a in D12 so they could be 4a.
Ram, I think last year may have been a bit of an outlier. Academy Park and Whitehall weren't great teams. But like Burrs alluded to, Springfield may be the real deal in 5A District 1. I'll be at the game vs GV and quite frankly can't wait. I think it will be a dog fight. Everyone holds GV and their program in very high regard. This is a big time game in District 1; arguably the top 6A and 5A team squaring off. I think GV will come out on top, but again I think it'll be close. It's a real litmus test for Springfield and I'm curious to see how they hold up.
Additionally, Harrisburg is absolutely loaded this year. If you asked me for a prediction, I'd say they beat AW in the state final. I think AW is very solid this year, but I don't think they are great. We'll have a much better idea in two weeks.
Additionally, Harrisburg is absolutely loaded this year. If you asked me for a prediction, I'd say they beat AW in the state final. I think AW is very solid this year, but I don't think they are great. We'll have a much better idea in two weeks.
GV is a fun team to watch and I hope they take the top spot in D-1 in 6 A. Harrisburg has a dynamic offense with no big gaps that are noticeable . Their QB is very underrated IMO. Receivers are fast and reliable and what a player Parsons is. I have seen him 3 times and am more impressed each time he plays.I like him best as DE ,but he is a beast when he carries the ball. Wood has the best shot at keeping pace with them offensively.If the two of them meet in the 5 A final I believe it will be a high scoring affair and at this point I could not pick a sure winner like many football followers in Pa.that have HSBG the champ. Should be a classic.
If AW gets that far and for a week all they hear is how big of an underdog they are, then I'd like them in that role.
Romeo, if it's a shootout, Wood loses. I don't think they are built for that this year. Come November and December, Wood is a ground and pound team that plays great defense. If they get into a high-scoring affair with Harrisburg, I like Harrisburg's talent and athleticism to win out.
I agree with this. Wood would need to control the ball and milk the clock in that type of match-up. Stay even for awhile, then grab a lead. Have HH panic some and that would lead to additional mistakes. If a team like HH front runs then AW likely has little shot.
Not sure and I think you can shed some light on this but isn't the policy that you can only move up in classification if you so choose but not down. As you said the numbers are the numbers.
Correct. There is no moving down within PIAA classes. In a few weeks schools will get the numbers and where they stand in terms of class. They will then have a month to decide if they'd like to move up. Move up only!
Now, the PCL set-up might change from what we see now. Some schools could petition to not be in a league with 6A teams if they aren't a 6A team. For example, hypothetically, if Wood, Ryan, and Carroll went from 5A to a 4A class, then they might say it's a two class difference and we don't want to do a Red/Blue set-up in this go-around. How about we go back to individual class divisions. An example could be....
6A: SJP, LS, RC, & FJ
4A: AW, AR, AC, BP, CO
3A/2A: CE, LC, WC, NG, & BM
Again, this isn't what I'm hearing but just a thought on what it could look like. I have no clue where teams are going to fall within the PIAA classifications at this point.
Why do you people always try to attach “recruiting” as a negative to Imhotep and NG? Lame excuses. The hate for coach Albie and his body of work in this city is purely f*ckery. PCL team across the board go out and recruit kids. Devlin himself built his teams with transfers. From the People’s cousins(St. Joes Prep/Abington), Raheem Blackshear, Kyle Pitts (Abington), Nate Smith (Washington), etc. So go cry a river!!!! Parents send their kids to who they want. It’s their right! Everyone does it!!! You people make me sick with these lame complaints. O’Hara has kids from all over as well. Chester County in particular. Devlin is running from the competition indeed. Coward!!!
I wouldn't say that Devlin "built" his team with transfers. Have they benefited from transfers over the years? Yes. But it's been more of a sprinkling of players each year, with the foundation of that team still coming from players who entered as freshman and stayed four years. Recruiting 8th graders is ok in my book. Having a few transfers from year to year is the norm at a lot of places. N-G's construction of their team this year wasn't the "normal" standard, but I get that they came from a place where the program almost folded and maybe extreme measures were needed. It will be interested to see how things go moving forward in this regard.
Yeah it’s clear that you hate the fact that Crosby is in a division with your beloved West Catholic Burrs! You are in fact biased in your statement. Fluck has benefited from transfers as well over the years. Wonder how that WC state championship team was built. Do you want to credit Crosby for that one too?
West benefited from four North players after their school closed. Every other significant contributor on that team was a 4-year player. Every school gets transfers; usually at a reasonable level. No one gets 25 in one season.
Albie was a an effective and good assistant coach on that team and in the program for many years, but if you think the dynamics as an assistant in 2010 and those as a head coach, in the heat of the offseason 7-on-7 era of 2017 is the same, then I'm not sure what to tell you.
