The Piaa has beaten prep (Mt Lebo & pine Richland) but for every 1 year you get that argument you have 5 years like this one were Harrisburg and gv got destroyed by prep and we missed out on a great state championship.
My takeaway from the 2022 state championships
- Thread starter northalleghenytiger
- Start date
Why not actually go onto the websites of schools like LaSalle and Malvern Prep--and all the other Interac schools--and check out their facilities.
Tulla-regarding the topic of "facilities" in Western Pa, pretty much all of the of the "public HSs" have better facilities that the private/Catholic schools. More funding and school budgets- that's like 130 HSs, so no need to "search websites"
Ah, I don't think so. Many moons ago when my son was playing for La Salle, they didn't wait for some alumni to donate. They came right up to the parents and said 'Get it the f@ck up!" No county or township funding, no tax hike for the community. Just the parents. Go figure!!
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So you’ve essentially proven the point - why would a parent pay tuition when public’s are free??!!! - there is much more to it than sports, yes, visibility helps, but the ability to excel academically holds far more value and parents are willing to make that sacrifice - also, Philly specifically and the surrounding counties in general have always considered parochial and private school as a choice and in many cases, a better choice, it’s a population density issue and subsequently, a quality of education issue - Prep, Roman, LaSalle, Goretti, Bonner, O’Hara, Carrol, West, Judge, Ryan and many others provide a better choice, even compared to some of the better districts - the interac is it’s own world which is likely one of the more exclusive set ups in the entire country - in reality, the paradigm has shifted to the eastern side of the state for the balance of players due to simple demographics
I'm not arguing that you get a better education and yes they are expense. I know I went to a private school from kindergarten all the way through college My argument is that the pcl puts together these super all star teams which is fine too. I think the kids should be able to play sports but I don't think it's fair for them to participate in the Piaa playoffs.
Exactly alumni, parents, donations is what I said. Almost all private schools don't have the best facilities otherwise. Some don't even have their own fields yet are national powers. Preps not unique in that way.
"Exactly alumni, parents, donations is what I said. " No what you said exactly was, "Unless an aluminum donates a large amount of money for the sports facilities...." In your original post you said just aluminum, I guess you meant alumni. No mention of the parents. Just some filthy rich alumnus shelling out the cash to keep the program up. I'm sorry but a lot of sacrifice went into it too! Some of you guys think "Ship Junior off to the privates and everything will take care of itself and before you know it, he'll be in a D1 program!!" That aint how it happens
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The parents will raise money along with boosters but you're not getting top notch facilities or football fields without alumini donations which includes prep. I can gaurantee you most their money is raised by alumni donations. They send an alumni letter quarterly asking for donations. I know how private schools work. I've been a product of them my whole life and my parents were teachers in them. St Joe's doesnt have disadvantages most private schools don't have. Most private schools don't have the best facilities but what the pcl does have is top notch talent. Let's just see how they do in this year's piaa basketball tournament. Check back with me then.
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I would say most National powers do have superior facilities than the Prep. I watched st Thoman Aquinas and Bishop Gorman on ESPN this year Those stadiums were unbelievable , and know bergan Catholic,Don Boscoe Prep and the North Jersey Powers have great facilities. How about those Texas powers wow. The schools in the PCL only have one small stadium ,not comparable to the aforementione and that is Cardinal O Hara.
Hasn't prep played some of their regular season games at Rutgers stadium and on espn? No other high school teams in pa get to go that. That draws talent in right there.
The powers in Texas are all public schools not private. I don't recall prep playing a single game at a run down stadium this year either. What other team in pa flew out to Florida to play a game? I'm sure all those players were put up in hotels and bought plane tickets which is not cheap. Hasn't prep played some of their regular season games at Rutgers stadium and on espn? What other pa teams get that. That draws talent in right there. Prep doesn't have it as bad as you guys make it. They have it better then most schools in pa. I'd be willing to bet espn will cover the img game next year and Ill bet itll be played in a stadium nicer then anyother school in pa gets to play on. Also you guys say img brings the best talent from all over the country I'm putting my money on prep next year so what's that tell you. I'd also be willing to bet prep has more talent on their team the the rest of the state combined. The pcl brings that talent in. Like I said let's see the blow outs by the pcl in this year's basketball tournament and then let's talk. Nuemann is a D1 basketball team. Give me an example of another school in pa that's constantly bringing in the talent that prep does in football and nuemann in basketball year in and year out?
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It’s clear you have an axe to grind after being proven wrong on a number of items including a few in this response. Prep plays their home games at O’Hara, not exactly the Taj Mahal and I’m sure you didn’t know that. The played Judge this year at Gamp playground in northeast Philly, it’s straight dust bowl. So consider yourself updated and corrected on that issue. The away games are the financial responsibility of the parents and kids usually stay with their parents or a parent so there are no issues. Yes, arrangements are made for any hardships, but insinuating that the team is ‘sponsored’ somehow is wrong. They do two fund raisers throughout the year including a golf outing and a block pool that helps with equipment and field rental fees for the season. Again, they don’t have their own field. Prep has been invited to the Rumble on the Raritan at Rutgers a few times. They usually play St Peter’s who is local there. It is a series of games over the weekend and the games are prearranged and yes, to the point that was made earlier, to which you reiterated and we agree, it does create a draw and attraction for kids. There is talent all over the state, but yes, most is stacked in demographically dense SE PA, particularly the Philly area. It’s been that way all along and the PCL has operated that way for some time now. Prep gets talent on the vacuum they’ve created over time and they develop that talent. But that talent comes from a much smaller area than has been repeatedly stated. IMG draws nationally and its well noted. Their facilities are state of the art and if prep beats them, it will have far more to do with coaching than talent. I believe Prep will also play Bishop Gorman in Vegas as their away game next year. This is how Prep handles their program, it could change, who knows, and if folks don’t like it, I actually understand, having open boundary is an advantage, but there many sacrifices and limitations that come as well.
If you are a good fb player in Philly and surrounding suburbs you have reps from every PCL team at your 8th grade games.
Prep, and to a lesser degree Lasalle, will tell this player and their parents that instead of paying $10,000 to attend AC, O’Hara, Wood, Egan etc you can come here for same price. Since Prep is over $25,000, most parents will jump on this opportunity to play for a team that wins every year and receives national exposure, not to mention receiving a far superior education.
Other PCL schools do not have the alumni support, booster club support, etc to compete with Prep/LaSalle and lose these potential players.
Not to mention if you’re a great 8th grade player you’re paying far less and sometimes virtually nothing to attend Prep. Economics play a major role in deciding.
You are definitely down playing the the range of area prep gets their players from. You think a small little t section of Philly is able to complete with img academy. A national power that gets the best talent from all over the country. I think prep gets their players from the north east region. Not just Philly and nj. They are an all star team and can complete with other all star teams such as img and st Thomas Aquinas.
** Adding my view; I don't see how it matters where IMG gets their All-Stars, Nevada, Cal, Tex, Ohio. If they're all 4, 5 stars, and for the sake of the conversation, let's call them of equal ability, and St. Joe's gets their 3, 4 and 5 stars from Philly burbs however distant (Jersey), I don't see the difference.
** About facilities, SJP's are abysmal. My question is, why?....when in truth, many other schools have a better practice field.
I saw them at Widener and O'Hara over the years. Why can't they work out something permanant. Can't be $, unless other schools have discovered a secret formula to acquiring funds and building facilities. Makes NO sense.
** About facilities, SJP's are abysmal. My question is, why?....when in truth, many other schools have a better practice field.
I saw them at Widener and O'Hara over the years. Why can't they work out something permanant. Can't be $, unless other schools have discovered a secret formula to acquiring funds and building facilities. Makes NO sense.
You’re wrong - within one hour - you simply can’t accept it for what it is. Now you’re just sounding like a bitter idiot.
Stalk -
Proximity is the biggest issue for practice. They were sharing a field along Broad that they had invested in with the city and an NFL grant for inner city youth. The field is shared with local teams and unfortunately last summer, while lacrosse was practicing, gun fire broke out in the stands so that is a very limited choice now. Believe it or not, money is an issue. Land is not abundantly available along Girard ave, and any availability would be cost prohibitive. There is Girard college, but their grounds are limited and the college considers it a liability to have any other teams practice there. They practice on a side field at temple that they have to bus to. For now, home game field is O’Hara as it’s become the only option.
North East Region? I sorta doubt that just based on school availability and practicality.
If you are in Central and North Jersey, you have several options of great private football schools to go to.
If you are south of Philly a ways, go to St. Francis in Baltimore or one of the other school in that Balt/DC Catholic league.
If you are west, go to McDevitt in Harrisburg.
Maybe if you are in the Allentown area you might make the trip, but that 75-90 minutes.
I really, really doubt more than a small handful of kids come from more than 25 miles away from Girard Ave. (Which includes Jersey and DE) MD is about 40 miles away.
If you are in Central and North Jersey, you have several options of great private football schools to go to.
If you are south of Philly a ways, go to St. Francis in Baltimore or one of the other school in that Balt/DC Catholic league.
If you are west, go to McDevitt in Harrisburg.
Maybe if you are in the Allentown area you might make the trip, but that 75-90 minutes.
I really, really doubt more than a small handful of kids come from more than 25 miles away from Girard Ave. (Which includes Jersey and DE) MD is about 40 miles away.
I suggest looking at the list of Phila. Area players that signed with Division 1 programs that did not attend the Prep. They dont get the best all the time for sure ,not even in the PCL. Interesting article from todys Phila Inquire that listed 8 former Phila Bishop McDevitt players that signed offers yesterday. These players of course had to attend other schools when McD closed last year. There were none that transferred to the Prep. A few notables are Bridgeman/ Imhotep to Michigan Gardener and Evans /Wood to Army Whittaker/Northeast to Temple marcus Dixson /Wood to Clemson Jamiel Lyons /Roman to Penn State. Add in the other players from just Phila going to Texas A@M, Kentucky Nebraska and the like .
Good points roxy. And I don't know circumstance how others came about having facilities (Jersey) et al in the East.
The South is in some ways newer to the game considering the relatively recent pop increase, meaning land for a field was factored in when the schools were built (STA-Lauderdale) and far cheaper, in FL, GA, LA, etc than Philly.
It clarifies things considering Phila not having available land that is affordable vs a more recent (affluent?) Bishop Gorman Field in Las Vegas.
McDevitt in Harrisburg made it happen with a key issue as you mention being land........that was available in the burbs out by CD and CD East that was affordable and not in the city.
Thanks for the explanation.
You are getting more and more delusional. The Prep has never had a student whose family has not lived within commuting distance of the school. It may be a long commute--up to 75 minutes--but never from Maryland, north Jersey, west of Chester County, or from the Lehigh Valley. The great majority of the students and most of the players travel 5-15 miles each way.
Roxy, Where would you like to see the Prep play their home games? PW, I understand, got quite expensive and was quite far from where most Prep students live. Widener was maybe even harder to get to for most. O'Hara is a little better in terms of location but not all that much better. I've wondered if the South Philly supersite (12th and Bigler) might be a good choice because how easy it is to get to from all directions, though, as I remember, parking could be a problem. I'd also like to see some improvements to the facility.
I'm not the one resorting to insults because you don't agree. You're the one acting like a child and if all those players live right around the school that's impressive the amount of college football talent that lives right in the neighborhood around prep. Especially every year in and year out.
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Tulla -
PW was the best site. LaSalle, Prep and Roman all played there as home field, so many games were compounded with the teams playing each other. The tailgating was fun and expansive and PW grew tired and pulled the plug on all by making it cost prohibitive. PW never drew fans like the parochials (to the dismay of the board). O’Hara is the best option for access and parking. It keeps the money in PCL at O’Hara and hopefully, they can grow. The issue is far bigger than folks realize. There are just not enough kids playing football anymore. PIAA just passed guidance on NIL and that will modify things further. I think NIL and portal are ruining college football but I’m just another opinion. I also think more Catholic high schools will close. The ultimate answer is open enrollment everywhere but the union won’t have it. The administrators and upper hierarchy in these districts make big money, quite a number in excess of $200k per year. The thought of competition is their Achilles heal. It’s about self preservation on the tax dollar. Long answer but no easy answer for Prep and fields.
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PW was the best for most of us in Bucks and Montgomery county and it was near the OLD ALE House LOL.
Well- a week ago, I would have said, SJP deserves and has fairly earned all their success, great coaching, great systems....
....I was gonna stay out of this but...
mmm, this "Calvary" post seems to prove Haus's point?? unfair advantages?
1- Catholic league having very different rules and process than public schools
2- rampant, and widely known recruiting? of eighth graders?
3- convincing parents with "matching or discounted tuition?"
4- even if not common, having no boundaries, sjp COULD take a kid from 30 miles away, maybe from another state??
5- having the option and flexibility to adjust their own schedule, and have the admin or parent or booster support (whatever you want to call it) to play out-of-state, maybe more than once a year- so that will "further draw" talented kids?
6- dense population- leading to additional advantage to sjp, magnifying the effect of the first 5 things
I can tell you, 95% of the HSs in the state do NOT have these advantages, when trying to win PIAA titles? Maybe we SHOULD have public / private, separate titles
Our Coach at PR was trying to "emulate" SJP- and that contributed to him getting fired. We have "recovered" for now, but that was a factor.
This is news to you???? Of course they have unfair advantages
We need to separate public/private
It's not good for the kids or the fans. Who wants to see these all star teams mercy rule every 6A school in the playoffs next year. Watch what Imhotep and Neumann do in the basketball playoffs. All games will be blowouts. It's accentually a college team taking on high school public schools. Who wants to watch that.
1) the PCL rules existed long before PIAA
2) rampant - LOL - pcl for years has made kids aware of their schools, frankly, they are better choices
3) tuition - LOL - every kid in public school is on full scholarship
4) SJP has students from PA and NJ, they have been getting students from NJ for over 70 years and students are within 45 minute radius - the multi state comments have been proven wrong
5) Prep has played a challenging preseason schedule for over 30 years - every school has that option
6) population - LOL - let’s ask folks to move
Frankly, this is all whining from the other side of the state which once was the Mecca of football but no longer due to population shifts and simply, less kids playing the sport. It was only a year ago that Lebo won and decisively. Yes, Prep has an advantage for open enrollment as do a number of other schools throughout the state. Frankly, the public schools in Philly suck and the need to recruit isn’t as intense as indicated. 68% of students at Prep get aid based on need, but every student pays tuition and not just a stipend either. You can take the PCL out of PIAA and it will remain best league in the state.
Number of championships from each district the past 2 years:
D1: 0
D2:0
D3:2
D4:2
D6:1
D7:6
D8:0
D10:0
D11:0
D12:1
WPIAL not be as dominant as it once was, but it is still the best district in PA when it comes to football. An all star team that consists of Philly and New Jersey kids doesn’t change this fact
D1: 0
D2:0
D3:2
D4:2
D6:1
D7:6
D8:0
D10:0
D11:0
D12:1
WPIAL not be as dominant as it once was, but it is still the best district in PA when it comes to football. An all star team that consists of Philly and New Jersey kids doesn’t change this fact
Wpial won the the top 4 classifications last year and all public schools at that.
Can we please stop with the two states thing. It’s overrated. I rather ppl say the next town over. I’m pretty sure there’s boundary schools with bigger talent pools. If you take the jersey players away do you think it’ll make much difference?
none of what you listed makes the kids at SJP slower, smaller, weaker, less athletic etc
Never understood why La Salle University never put their hat in the ring, unless they were asking too much. MacCarthey Stadium is a great site at a very good location for surrounding schools.
Maybe some of the problems they had when the PCL basketball championships were at LaSalle have had something to do with LaSalle's lack of interest in making some upgrades to McCarthy and then renting it for PCL use.
I just looked, thanks to Google, at the site of the old Cahill Field on 29th near Clearfield and it looks like it's a vacant large lot. It was used (and owned?) by Roman for many years and was big enough to accommodate about 10,000. The problems with this site and the many others like it within the city are 1) parking and 2) safety and security. Solving #1 could help with #2 but some people will still want/need to take public transportation.
I suppose there is also the question of what the future holds. I've long thought the Archdiocese should take a property it owns in a relatively central location that is no longer being used (Hallahan?--though that property may not be big enough) and consider making it available to several PCL schools (Roman, N-G, WC, and SJP?) for their home games--meaning that on an average fall weekend it might be used both on Friday night and on Saturday. It could be seen as a way of promoting Catholic high schools. Of course, some of those properties--certainly the Hallahan site, which may already have been sold--could fetch a good price on the real estate market--and we all know the Archdiocese needs money. There's also the issue of how many of the high schools will survive for 5, 10, or 15 more years and, if they do, whether they'll all have football teams and football teams that get much support.
