Ridley Upper Darby

[defcon3]

Caught this tilt last night. Green Raiders get into the playoffs, and may have found something offensively the last few games (albeit against not so great defenses). May save the OCs job though.

Do you think that Upper Darby ever gets tired of being the most underachieving laughing stock program in Delaware County. I mean, year in and year out they always seem to find ways to inexplicably lose games, especially since I believe they are one of the biggest high schools in the district.

They always have talented skill and lineman, but never seem to do anything with it. Too many coverage breakdowns, stupid penalties, turnovers. I have been going to games for a long time, and every time I have seen them play its always the same sheet of music.

And before the "Upper Darby has challenges that other schools dont have to deal with" crowd comments, I would imagine the guy at AP faced similar challenges and he has built that program into a perennial contender. All it takes is the right coach.

 

[footballwhiz]

I would agree to a degree. I do think they have that “large school” tag but shouldn’t be lumped into the same category as most of the big schools. Not the same kids as the other big schools. Garnet, North Penn and even ridley all get diff types of kids. It’s easy to say they “should” be better but who really knows why they aren’t. Is the coaching that bad over there? I would imaging it’s easier to coach a team like Garnet/NP than a Reading, UD, Chester and AP. UD is an above average program. I don’t know enough about their staff to make a judgement tho.

 

[SPEED&JUMP DR.]

Gentile at UD might be more of a head scratcher than GAllagher at HVerford. 23 years at the helm and with zero Central league titles and I believe one playoff win. They get a pretty good mix of big strong linemen and quick athletic skill players. Yet they generally underachieve more than any team in Delco. The Ridley faithful this week were quietly banking on " UD pulling a UD" , which is lose to a team they have no business losing And they did.

 

[delcofootball1]

Caught this tilt last night. Green Raiders get into the playoffs, and may have found something offensively the last few games (albeit against not so great defenses). May save the OCs job though.

Do you think that Upper Darby ever gets tired of being the most underachieving laughing stock program in Delaware County. I mean, year in and year out they always seem to find ways to inexplicably lose games, especially since I believe they are one of the biggest high schools in the district.

They always have talented skill and lineman, but never seem to do anything with it. Too many coverage breakdowns, stupid penalties, turnovers. I have been going to games for a long time, and every time I have seen them play its always the same sheet of music.

And before the "Upper Darby has challenges that other schools dont have to deal with" crowd comments, I would imagine the guy at AP faced similar challenges and he has built that program into a perennial contender. All it takes is the right coach.

What's your answer for it then? Get the right coach? I'm sure there are coaches who pretend to know about that job but wouldn't be able to handle the ins and outs of a program like that. I would assume they have different challenges than lets say a team like Springfield or a Malvern. It's pretty different coaching kids from families with money and resources. But any average "JOE" could do that. A staff like that is in it more for changing lives and impacting young men, instead of chasing money and the perfect job with no issues. Like I said though, any average "JOE" could do that right?

 

[Gang $$ Green]

The heir apparent is on the staff and very well respected. He was the runner up for the O'Hara job last time through. Academy Park is a decent analogy but not right on point due to logistics. Upper Darby has kids disappear for a multitude of reasons. Very hard place but certainly get some nice talent. They have a group of alumni guys who have put together a really neat outreach program that has some nice stories of affecting kids. I think it highlights have unbelievable a job Vo has done at AP. These "right" guys are pretty hard to find. All it takes is the right coach sounds great in theory and way harder in practice. It isn't the SEC. If it all took was the right guy and it was that easy wouldn't Jason be the coach at Ridley? We all know its way more complicated than that. In fact a lot of that is why Central League sucked for years. More who is in the building thinking rather then who is right coach and can we get them in the building. Some of that union mentality and lack of understanding of how many good assistant coaches you really need at top program been a problem for years. You have 120 kids in your program you need a stable of guys who know their stuff to coach them all. Not just whomever is teaching chemistry.

 

[HSFballFan19]

Gang, spot on analysis and not enough people understand this. Quality assistant coaches are essential to a good program. Even if you have a great head coach, he needs competent assistants to be successful. Why? Because those assistants (either as position coaches or coordinators) are the ones running drills and often installing schemes.

For example, say you have an offensive head coach, his defensive coordinator is installing the game plan each week and his position coaches are responsible for delivering that message to their respective positions. The head coach can't be everywhere at all times!

 

[SPEED&JUMP DR.]

Money and resources have very little to do with it. If it were that easy, Stoga, Lower Merion, and Harriton would contend every year. Did you see their combined records this year? And while the population of the school has changed over the years, the student population was not like this 20 years ago-and they stiill could not win 20 years ago. Maybe the guy just cannot coach?

 

[Gang $$ Green]

Speed you are good poster. I don’t follow your logic here at all. I might be misunderstanding you or your point. The foundation for winning is talent. We all understand that. Then you need coaching from top down and a commitment from the school, kids and community.

Not enough talent at lower merion or harriton. Not going to win there. Conestoga had a guy who had great assistants and got quite a bit out of what they had. He’s not there now.

I’m not saying Richie is Lombardi. However that is a very unique situation. The district employs multiple people to remove students going to school there who don’t reside in the district. Ton of apartments and rentals that involve turnover in district. Lots of ESL and other communities that know nothing about football. It’s a hard place to coach. Could they, should they be better. Maybe. Let’s put it this way there are some very good coaches who would not or could not last a season there based upon what I’ve seen there over the years.

If you are a history guy I refer you to Upper Darby from 1970s to 1990. Horrendous.This regime made them relevant. Let’s face facts. Other than Ridley and Haven for ten years the historic bar is pretty low for Central League football tradition for past 40 years. Now that the talent is better it’s time for these programs and administrations to step up. Part of that will be moving away from the 5 teacher coaching model that has been part of the leagues weekness forever. Look at the number and makeup of garnet valley coaching staff vs a lot of Central teams and it’s not that surprising they are the ones making noise at district level.

 

[SPEED&JUMP DR.]

GG. I guess my point is everyone keeps making excuses for the guy ( lack of money , lack of support , make up of the student body , etc ) and maybe it's just the guy ? Its not like he's been there 3 years. After 23 years m he really has nothing to show for it. And I certainly do not think they are relevant. They find a way to win in basketball , wrestling , track &field and baseball. So it's not the kids , or the school

Part of the job of being a head coach is changing the culture. Vosheski at AP, Gicking at MN , Gal at Hav ( you pointed that out ) , even Penn Wood this year, all managed to do that. But it takes a lot of work , a year round commitment I'm not suggesting they are North Penn , but they really have nothing to show for his 23 year tenure.

 

[Gang $$ Green]

Speed fair enough. You aren't a Richie fan. I really like their O coordinator and they have some other good pieces. I might also argue they are more relevant in football then they have been in basketball in grand scheme but we probably don't want to get me started on Central League hoops. Actually UD has done something Haverford hasn't in football win a District playoff game. I think when Ruffenach gets his turn he will be very good. Issue may be that he gets tired of waiting at some point and he becomes somebody elses head coach. We can agree on one thing. A stronger UD would be good for the Central League. Conestoga also. That would only make the teams that come out better at District time. Very interested to see how these teams fair in Districts at 5a and 6a. My inclination is the league was pretty good but we shall see in the results starting this week.

 

[SPEED&JUMP DR.]

GG: You are right. If Ruffenach is a good as everyone thinks he can be, it would be a shame to lose a born & bred Drexel Hill guy to another school. But I know he has applied for jobs in the past and likely will this off season as well. Its only a matter of time.

So let me ask you this hypothetical. Ruffenack gets offered the Bonner job and along with it he will bring some coaches and players with him. But before accepting, he goes to UD and basically says hed rather be the head coach at UD than Bonner but he's tired of waiting. What would you do?

 

[South Ave Sam]

Speed, 2 things in that scenario, first - Upper Darby job is politically controlled, probably not too focused on being in a better football situation and definitely more concerned about school issues not involving athletics. Second - Bonner went thru that door last go round and lost out, doubt they would put themselves in another identical situation.

 

[PAfootball2013]

Ruffenach the UD OC? The offense that has come up short in every big game they've played recently? They have speed every year but show me this transcendent offense you're talking about. They spread it out and make some plays. Far from an "offense". Their talent is scary, offense is just ehhh. Sounds like he applies for every job out there and hasn't gotten one.