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SOL National 2023 and Looking Ahead to 2024

S
HSFB99 said:
Isn’t 2021 the year they went to the district final? Or was that 2020? I would have thought mueller was well liked. I’m surprised to hear that.
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2020 was the district final year - neither Soudy nor PR wanted what was to follow that game (SJPrep). So there wasn’t much motivation to advance (change the damn playoff structure already!)
Muller was liked by most and had a positive impact. His successor was one of his guys and had community and player support. The leadership (so called) in that district kills football. New super. New principal. Same AD = same outcome.
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SOL National 2023 and Looking Ahead to 2024

S
HSFB99 said:
Great write-up, as always. A couple things standout, a few questions (if you’ll indulge me!) and a few opinions…

West: arguably the favorites to win the SOL again? I’d put them and South projected 1 and 2. I like west in a playoff rematch due to west’s stout front 7.

South: seemed to have turned a corner. Wood being down has helped them tremendously. I believe Bowes is also a Wood transfer.

East: Donnelly hasn't won a playoff game at East?! I didn’t realize that. Going 4-6 with 3 All-State players is tough. Has that ever been done before?! No way it’s happened in the SOL.

North Penn: your question as to does Beck have one more run left in him…is he considering hanging it up after this year? I like NP to bounce back if they can get the defense to be even average.

Pennsbury: Snyder is a great coach, but the lose of the big FB hurt them. I’m unsure of what they return, but I’d expect an improvement.

Nesh: they are definitely struggling to find their identity. Wilmots last run? They have too many kids to be this average.

Pennridge: curious about your comment on the coach’s commitment. Does he still work in the Lehigh Valley? If so, him not being the building would really hurt. Also, isn’t there a younger Picciotti coming up in the system?

Abington: who’s taking that job at this time of year? You have to feel for the kids, especially the seniors.
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My skins may make a run for the old coach! If it’s his last go round, maybe the kids and community will show up for em. We can hope.

Pennridge is still a disaster. The common denominator is AD. As long as his hand is in that program, it will continue to underachieve. He is not a football guy by all accounts - contrary to his own opinion. A school that size and they just don’t value competitive football by micromanaging and mismanaging. Sad. Kids with any talent will be lured away to private schools while the AD strokes his ego pretending to be a “football guy.”

Abington is another one. They railroaded the last HC. They’ll continue to be poached by private schools. It amazes me that parents invest so much in their youth sports, but in the wrong way - a self centered way. The team aspect of football is being polluted by flag and 7s leagues that focus on me me me. Parents continue to rip those giving their time and effort to these kids. Who’d wanna be a coach?!

East seems to be heading down. They had their bite of the apple with Shine and underwhelmed in the postseason.

West probably down some too.

Those downward trending teams will probably make Ridge and Neshaminy look deceivingly better than they are this season. That’s HS FB though, right?
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SJP in Philadelphia Magazine

T
2020sports said:
never said it would be "easy" for PCC to do what SJP has done. but maybe just as, or almost as good. I'm pretty sure most would agree that in Pa, PCC is the "most similar" to prep, but the result in the last 10-15 is so much different. Even for North Allegheny, they have tremendous resources, good program, and got crushed by prep, it just makes no sense. Part of the reason is wpial is much more strict than the Philly area- another reason is having different rules for private/non-boundary. As i have said before- im not sure the answer is to have seperate playoffs- maybe the answer is to have rules be more consistent from "district to district"

idk
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Scranton Prep and then LaSalle are the schools most similar to SJP.
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SJP in Philadelphia Magazine

2
tulla said:
You seem to think that going from SJP to Temple to PSU, etc. was a kind of automatic process. When Infante started at the Prep, the program was in disarray. The big-name players almost all left when brooks left and the first year with Infante they were 4-7. As for his career since, at each school he gets evaluated and each move comes with a risk. Nobody put a gun to anyone's head at PSU and told them to hire Infante. And I would bet just about anything that Infante is not making seven figures. If Duke's defense plays badly this year--or they bring in a new hc--Infante could be gone

As for Roken, this will be his 15th year coaching at SJP--his sixth as head coach. If it was all about advancing his career, he'd have been gone by now.

Yes, there are some big differences between SJP's program and that of most schools. But you should recognize that with SJP's advantages come several risks. It's a bit of a high-wire act. Lots of kids come to the school expecting they'll be starters, maybe that they'll be featured on ESPN, but that may not happen for many. Also, every year they lose players, some very talented ones, because of the academic demands. Being consistently good doesn't come automatically.

The idea that PCC could easily do the same if only the WPIAL were less strict is fanciful.
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never said it would be "easy" for PCC to do what SJP has done. but maybe just as, or almost as good. I'm pretty sure most would agree that in Pa, PCC is the "most similar" to prep, but the result in the last 10-15 is so much different. Even for North Allegheny, they have tremendous resources, good program, and got crushed by prep, it just makes no sense. Part of the reason is wpial is much more strict than the Philly area- another reason is having different rules for private/non-boundary. As i have said before- im not sure the answer is to have seperate playoffs- maybe the answer is to have rules be more consistent from "district to district"

idk
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SJP in Philadelphia Magazine

T
2020sports said:
wow- i have tried to stay objective- and not "cry that things are unfair" for SJP.

but this thread?? SJP clearly follows very different rules than 95% of other PA schools. "calling it marketing instead of recruiting?" that's ridiculous. It sounds like Brooks "openly recruited" and then Infante "aggressively marketed" over a span of like 20 years? No friggin wonder. Same basic thing. If that was "allowed" in WPIAL, then PCC would likely be "just as big and good as SJP." for those two programs, state titles in the last 10 years- maybe 8 to 0?

The Philly area clearly has not had consistent and strict rules for HS football in the last 10-15 years, maybe longer? I can tell you, having been "in and around" WPIAL HS FB for 30 years, that crap is rare and not "commonly accepted" in the Pgh area.

And Paul? cmon. The reason why Infante did not "go to a public school?" Cuz he had the SJP job? nope. The biggest reasons why he "worked so hard to make the program great" was because he was "dedicated to the great program?" nope.

His reasons, imo, were that he was making SJP "high profile" to further his career. Lots of PA coaches work hard for 20 years, maybe make 15k, in addition to their "day job. " Some lucky ones have a school job- maybe crack 6 figures- make 100k.

Infante went from Temple, to PSU, now Duke. Probably now making SEVEN figures- assistant head coach? Coordinators at P4 now make 1 million. I wonder about the coach now, Roken? Maybe he does the same thing in a couple of years?
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You seem to think that going from SJP to Temple to PSU, etc. was a kind of automatic process. When Infante started at the Prep, the program was in disarray. The big-name players almost all left when brooks left and the first year with Infante they were 4-7. As for his career since, at each school he gets evaluated and each move comes with a risk. Nobody put a gun to anyone's head at PSU and told them to hire Infante. And I would bet just about anything that Infante is not making seven figures. If Duke's defense plays badly this year--or they bring in a new hc--Infante could be gone

As for Roken, this will be his 15th year coaching at SJP--his sixth as head coach. If it was all about advancing his career, he'd have been gone by now.

Yes, there are some big differences between SJP's program and that of most schools. But you should recognize that with SJP's advantages come several risks. It's a bit of a high-wire act. Lots of kids come to the school expecting they'll be starters, maybe that they'll be featured on ESPN, but that may not happen for many. Also, every year they lose players, some very talented ones, because of the academic demands. Being consistently good doesn't come automatically.

The idea that PCC could easily do the same if only the WPIAL were less strict is fanciful.
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SJP in Philadelphia Magazine

2
wow- i have tried to stay objective- and not "cry that things are unfair" for SJP.

but this thread?? SJP clearly follows very different rules than 95% of other PA schools. "calling it marketing instead of recruiting?" that's ridiculous. It sounds like Brooks "openly recruited" and then Infante "aggressively marketed" over a span of like 20 years? No friggin wonder. Same basic thing. If that was "allowed" in WPIAL, then PCC would likely be "just as big and good as SJP." for those two programs, state titles in the last 10 years- maybe 8 to 0?

The Philly area clearly has not had consistent and strict rules for HS football in the last 10-15 years, maybe longer? I can tell you, having been "in and around" WPIAL HS FB for 30 years, that crap is rare and not "commonly accepted" in the Pgh area.

And Paul? cmon. The reason why Infante did not "go to a public school?" Cuz he had the SJP job? nope. The biggest reasons why he "worked so hard to make the program great" was because he was "dedicated to the great program?" nope.

His reasons, imo, were that he was making SJP "high profile" to further his career. Lots of PA coaches work hard for 20 years, maybe make 15k, in addition to their "day job. " Some lucky ones have a school job- maybe crack 6 figures- make 100k.

Infante went from Temple, to PSU, now Duke. Probably now making SEVEN figures- assistant head coach? Coordinators at P4 now make 1 million. I wonder about the coach now, Roken? Maybe he does the same thing in a couple of years?
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Pine-Richland 2024

2
new2pa said:
There were no freshman on the varsity roster between 2013 and 2020. Take those kids off on the current count.
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tyler king, luke meckler, max heckert, 9th grade varsity under EK

but yes i agree, i do not really "count" those 9th grade kids- current roster is 52, w 4 9th grade kids, 48 high school kids- bad for a "strong big school program"

new- if you remember i said 2 months ago, we might have as low as 55? well, 6-7 kids have quit since then- sadly tho it seems like #s is not just a pr thing, 2 locals teams cancelled games, in the Trib today
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Pine-Richland 2024

2
JACKY6996 said:
https://www.maxpreps.com/pa/gibsonia/pine-richland-rams/football/17-18/roster/ 2017, I count 64. Pr has never been like Na, pcc, etc putting out 80+ man rosters, and not sure where you guys are getting that they had a ton of kids under coach k. You’d be surprised some of the names that quit and played other sports under coach k, for various reasons but a lot of the time couldn’t handle the rigors of the program.
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jacky-- you seem to have some good inside knowledge- i appreciate you being a supporter of the program- but it is a big problem- less numbers. Lack of depth hurt us late in the season last year. Between about 2017 and 2020, PR had similar numbers as PCC and NA. Not now. This year, we will have 48 high school FB kids, in 2020 we had 78. It's a growing problem. Some good athletes at PR are walking away from football.
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Pine-Richland 2024

2
aerogenes said:
In recent years Pine-Richland, and a lot of other teams, are not fielding true freshman teams. They are calling them JV B teams, I think they will put sophomores on that team as well as freshman. The JV games are played Saturday mornings and the JV B games usually on Monday or Thursday.
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imo its a bad trend- seems like all schools are doing this, cuz of low numbers- you got 9th graders playing against 11, not good for development
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