Takeaway from worst year in piaa Championship history 2023

[northalleghenytiger]

Just gotBack to the hotel . First I’ll take about the 6 games this weekend then I’ll Segway into NA game.

First 5 out of the 6 games sucked. It was blowout city in the keystone state…. They only game that was good was the westinghouse verse southern game…. But the referee ruined that game so really it wasn’t that good, wpial won 2 gold which is decent but not great 👍. MY GOODNESS was this year not entertaining:/ if you thought this year was entertaining you need to consult with your therapist because you might be crazy. But that’s neither here nor thierye. This was definitely the worst year for the Piaa champions in my opinion. Too many blowout, and fake teams won to often. Realistically the last two years sucked. We need to dump the 6 class thing, completely ruined pa football for all the die hard fans such as myself… I think everyone on the website agrees with me on that topic so I’m really just preaching to the choir. In total, this year sucked for Piaa. Now onto the NA games

First let’s me rave and rant about the DUMB location this game was set at. Cumberland valley? What a joke. Let me guess, next year their going to have it in the parking lot of the Piaa offices? We must get rid of the Piaa. Bad location really bad. But I already talked about the awful location last year so let’s not dwell on that.

Next, this is the first time I saw St joeys prep live. They are easily the best high school football team I’ve ever seen and it’s not close. And I’ve been watching for awhile. If you think a team would be able to beat the one I just saw youre a brain dead idiot plain and simple… they’ll have 20 all state player if I guess which is.

But honestly why wouldn’t they be the best team? They have players from 3 different states, really big joke that there allowed to play public schools like NA! They’re a fake team I hope the Sjp fans are happy about the fake rings they’ve won. You robbed a team of a once in a lifetime opportunity

Now I’m really proud of the NA players. They’re a top 5 NA team I’ve seen since I started watching which is a testament to their hard work and skill and honestly I hope art walker junior never retire s. He is such a good coach I love him like he’s a father figure. I think we’ll win wpial next year but lose to Harrisburg which is okay cuz Harrisburg is a vert good team but they really need to sepe

They really need to separated public and private schools

 

[roxychknpoxy]

Just gotBack to the hotel . First I’ll take about the 6 games this weekend then I’ll Segway into NA game.

First 5 out of the 6 games sucked. It was blowout city in the keystone state…. They only game that was good was the westinghouse verse southern game…. But the referee ruined that game so really it wasn’t that good, wpial won 2 gold which is decent but not great 👍. MY GOODNESS was this year not entertaining:/ if you thought this year was entertaining you need to consult with your therapist because you might be crazy. But that’s neither here nor thierye. This was definitely the worst year for the Piaa champions in my opinion. Too many blowout, and fake teams won to often. Realistically the last two years

 

[tulla]

Just gotBack to the hotel . First I’ll take about the 6 games this weekend then I’ll Segway into NA game.

First 5 out of the 6 games sucked. It was blowout city in the keystone state…. They only game that was good was the westinghouse verse southern game…. But the referee ruined that game so really it wasn’t that good, wpial won 2 gold which is decent but not great 👍. MY GOODNESS was this year not entertaining:/ if you thought this year was entertaining you need to consult with your therapist because you might be crazy. But that’s neither here nor thierye. This was definitely the worst year for the Piaa champions in my opinion. Too many blowout, and fake teams won to often. Realistically the last two years sucked. We need to dump the 6 class thing, completely ruined pa football for all the die hard fans such as myself… I think everyone on the website agrees with me on that topic so I’m really just preaching to the choir. In total, this year sucked for Piaa. Now onto the NA games

First let’s me rave and rant about the DUMB location this game was set at. Cumberland valley? What a joke. Let me guess, next year their going to have it in the parking lot of the Piaa offices? We must get rid of the Piaa. Bad location really bad. But I already talked about the awful location last year so let’s not dwell on that.

Next, this is the first time I saw St joeys prep live. They are easily the best high school football team I’ve ever seen and it’s not close. And I’ve been watching for awhile. If you think a team would be able to beat the one I just saw youre a brain dead idiot plain and simple… they’ll have 20 all state player if I guess which is.

But honestly why wouldn’t they be the best team? They have players from 3 different states, really big joke that there allowed to play public schools like NA! They’re a fake team I hope the Sjp fans are happy about the fake rings they’ve won. You robbed a team of a once in a lifetime opportunity

Now I’m really proud of the NA players. They’re a top 5 NA team I’ve seen since I started watching which is a testament to their hard work and skill and honestly I hope art walker junior never retire s. He is such a good coach I love him like he’s a father figure. I think we’ll win wpial next year but lose to Harrisburg which is okay cuz Harrisburg is a vert good team but they really need to sepe

They really need to separated public and private schools

I doubt the one player from DE who might have dressed tonight got into the game, so why not drop the "three states" line? It is technically correct this year, but it creates a false picture--as if SJP has a stream of players coming from DE.

Calling SJP a fake team is nonsensical. The players go to a real school, work at least as hard as other teams, and make lots of sacrifices together.

As several on here have noted, there was one private school among the 12 finalists. So you're calling for a wholesale overhaul of the playoff system because of one school in one classification.

What to make of Southern Columbia winning yet another championship? The crucial call seemed a bad one--though we've all seen worse, just maybe not in that situation. But it's curious how little attention, relatively speaking, gets directed to them and the reasons for their success.

 

[roxychknpoxy]

Just gotBack to the hotel . First I’ll take about the 6 games this weekend then I’ll Segway into NA game.

First 5 out of the 6 games sucked. It was blowout city in the keystone state…. They only game that was good was the westinghouse verse southern game…. But the referee ruined that game so really it wasn’t that good, wpial won 2 gold which is decent but not great 👍. MY GOODNESS was this year not entertaining:/ if you thought this year was entertaining you need to consult with your therapist because you might be crazy. But that’s neither here nor thierye. This was definitely the worst year for the Piaa champions in my opinion. Too many blowout, and fake teams won to often. Realistically the last two years sucked. We need to dump the 6 class thing, completely ruined pa football for all the die hard fans such as myself… I think everyone on the website agrees with me on that topic so I’m really just preaching to the choir. In total, this year sucked for Piaa. Now onto the NA games

First let’s me rave and rant about the DUMB location this game was set at. Cumberland valley? What a joke. Let me guess, next year their going to have it in the parking lot of the Piaa offices? We must get rid of the Piaa. Bad location really bad. But I already talked about the awful location last year so let’s not dwell on that.

Next, this is the first time I saw St joeys prep live. They are easily the best high school football team I’ve ever seen and it’s not close. And I’ve been watching for awhile. If you think a team would be able to beat the one I just saw youre a brain dead idiot plain and simple… they’ll have 20 all state player if I guess which is.

But honestly why wouldn’t they be the best team? They have players from 3 different states, really big joke that there allowed to play public schools like NA! They’re a fake team I hope the Sjp fans are happy about the fake rings they’ve won. You robbed a team of a once in a lifetime opportunity

Now I’m really proud of the NA players. They’re a top 5 NA team I’ve seen since I started watching which is a testament to their hard work and skill and honestly I hope art walker junior never retire s. He is such a good coach I love him like he’s a father figure. I think we’ll win wpial next year but lose to Harrisburg which is okay cuz Harrisburg is a vert good team but they really need to sepe

They really need to separated public and private schools

Oh the irony - this was not a blowout like a number of the other finals - NA is impressive … hoping to make some contacts at NA to draw those under class men to SJP with no fields, small weight room, no tax dollars, tuition, and academic standards and expectations

 

[BradlyPitt]

Oh the irony - this was not a blowout like a number of the other finals - NA is impressive … hoping to make some contacts at NA to draw those under class men to SJP with no fields, small weight room, no tax dollars, tuition, and academic standards and expectations

a game that results in the mercy rule is a blowout

stop acting like the odds are stacked against SJP

 

[BradlyPitt]

I doubt the one player from DE who might have dressed tonight got into the game, so why not drop the "three states" line? It is technically correct this year, but it creates a false picture--as if SJP has a stream of players coming from DE.

Calling SJP a fake team is nonsensical. The players go to a real school, work at least as hard as other teams, and make lots of sacrifices together.

As several on here have noted, there was one private school among the 12 finalists. So you're calling for a wholesale overhaul of the playoff system because of one school in one classification.

What to make of Southern Columbia winning yet another championship? The crucial call seemed a bad one--though we've all seen worse, just maybe not in that situation. But it's curious how little attention, relatively speaking, gets directed to them and the reasons for their success.

i've been calling out Southern Columbia forever, only to be called a "hater"

7 straight titles, 14 total and they have been at the very least a consistent state finalist for the past 30 years

nobody will ever convince me they aren't bending the rules and there is some magical formula in that middle of nowhere cow town that keeps reproducing state title teams

if Jim Roth is that smart he would be making millions in the NFL

 

[BradlyPitt]

Just gotBack to the hotel . First I’ll take about the 6 games this weekend then I’ll Segway into NA game.

First 5 out of the 6 games sucked. It was blowout city in the keystone state…. They only game that was good was the westinghouse verse southern game…. But the referee ruined that game so really it wasn’t that good, wpial won 2 gold which is decent but not great 👍. MY GOODNESS was this year not entertaining:/ if you thought this year was entertaining you need to consult with your therapist because you might be crazy. But that’s neither here nor thierye. This was definitely the worst year for the Piaa champions in my opinion. Too many blowout, and fake teams won to often. Realistically the last two years sucked. We need to dump the 6 class thing, completely ruined pa football for all the die hard fans such as myself… I think everyone on the website agrees with me on that topic so I’m really just preaching to the choir. In total, this year sucked for Piaa. Now onto the NA games

First let’s me rave and rant about the DUMB location this game was set at. Cumberland valley? What a joke. Let me guess, next year their going to have it in the parking lot of the Piaa offices? We must get rid of the Piaa. Bad location really bad. But I already talked about the awful location last year so let’s not dwell on that.

Next, this is the first time I saw St joeys prep live. They are easily the best high school football team I’ve ever seen and it’s not close. And I’ve been watching for awhile. If you think a team would be able to beat the one I just saw youre a brain dead idiot plain and simple… they’ll have 20 all state player if I guess which is.

But honestly why wouldn’t they be the best team? They have players from 3 different states, really big joke that there allowed to play public schools like NA! They’re a fake team I hope the Sjp fans are happy about the fake rings they’ve won. You robbed a team of a once in a lifetime opportunity

Now I’m really proud of the NA players. They’re a top 5 NA team I’ve seen since I started watching which is a testament to their hard work and skill and honestly I hope art walker junior never retire s. He is such a good coach I love him like he’s a father figure. I think we’ll win wpial next year but lose to Harrisburg which is okay cuz Harrisburg is a vert good team but they really need to sepe

They really need to separated public and private schools

you are right about pretty much everything

arguably the most unwatchable championship year for sure but that happens sometimes

at least you got your 3 state titles, the last one the year before this SJP nightmare started

 

[lilromeo]

you are right about pretty much everything

arguably the most unwatchable championship year for sure but that happens sometimes

at least you got your 3 state titles, the last one the year before this SJP nightmare started

I thought you would at least acknowledge some of the players like Jones for their performance.

 

[2020sports]

this is a ridiculous "thread topic." Kudos to all the the teams making it, and the best teams won.

The subject of "Cumberland Valley" is not a new topic. They have nice parking and nice bathrooms. So does a brand new Target store. I've heard Buc-ees gas stations also have nice parking and nice bathrooms!!

 

[northalleghenytiger]

I thought you would at least acknowledge some of the players like Jones for their performance.

Yes they were great and I imagine a handful of the will make the NFL.

 

[northalleghenytiger]

I doubt the one player from DE who might have dressed tonight got into the game, so why not drop the "three states" line? It is technically correct this year, but it creates a false picture--as if SJP has a stream of players coming from DE.

Calling SJP a fake team is nonsensical. The players go to a real school, work at least as hard as other teams, and make lots of sacrifices together.

As several on here have noted, there was one private school among the 12 finalists. So you're calling for a wholesale overhaul of the playoff system because of one school in one classification.

What to make of Southern Columbia winning yet another championship? The crucial call seemed a bad one--though we've all seen worse, just maybe not in that situation. But it's curious how little attention, relatively speaking, gets directed to them and the reasons for their success.

Because their 2A no one really cares, this board doesn’t talk about the lower 3 classes

 

[northalleghenytiger]

Oh the irony - this was not a blowout like a number of the other finals - NA is impressive … hoping to make some contacts at NA to draw those under class men to SJP with no fields, small weight room, no tax dollars, tuition, and academic standards and expectations

We got mercy ruled. That’s a blowout

 

[lilromeo]

Yes they were great and I imagine a handful of the will make the NFL.

Tigers played hard. Liked #47 and the QB. Gutsy !! Semaj Jones stole the show. He runs like a fullback but with speed.. His passing, and decisions were on target. Cincinatti is getting a good one.

 

[northalleghenytiger]

Tigers played hard. Liked #47 and the QB. Gutsy !! Semaj Jones stole the show. He runs like a fullback but with speed.. His passing, and decisions were on target. Cincinatti is getting a good one.

Yeah he’s the physically strongest qb I’ve seen in high school. The first td he scored he went through 5 of our guys

 

[northalleghenytiger]

Does anyone think a public school past or present would be able to beat this years SJP team?

 

[sammyk]

Does anyone think a public school past or present would be able to beat this years SJP team?

Yes 1988 Carmichaels mighty mikes

 

[DripDrop]

Because their 2A no one really cares, this board doesn’t talk about the lower 3 classes

The difference between the 2 is SC is a public school and has competitive games with PA teams. They get kids from their district and is a successful program not a put together all star team.

 

[DripDrop]

Does anyone think a public school past or present would be able to beat this years SJP team?

This is the best team recruited of all the eastern all star teams and tournament history. The piaa allows for it. Even the announcer pointed out what they are doing is within the rules but yes it's not an even playing field. They will be even better next year. They also listed all the "service trips" the football team takes in the off season. Don't know of any other pa football team that takes so many out of state service trips and travels so much on their schedule.

 

[new2pa]

Does anyone think a public school past or present would be able to beat this years SJP team?

Yes. P-R 2017 would be one.

I think you’re a little biased. NA has a nice team this year, but I don’t think anyone is talking about them being an all time great WPIAL team.

From my viewpoint after watching, NA needs way more playmakers. Your best, Boyd disappeared. Particularly after Jones ran him over on the first TD. QB is a nice player but can’t dominate. Find playmakers and a way to get them the ball.

 

[tulla]

This is the best team recruited of all the eastern all star teams and tournament history. The piaa allows for it. Even the announcer pointed out what they are doing is within the rules but yes it's not an even playing field. They will be even better next year. They also listed all the "service trips" the football team takes in the off season. Don't know of any other pa football team that takes so many out of state service trips and travels so much on their schedule.

You know nothing about the service trips. As I've said on here several times, all SJP students take service trip; some go out of the country. The football team takes one a year; they don't play games or hold practices on the service trips. But for some reason you want to hold on to some ludicrous idea about them.

The have three starters returning on offense, four on defense, but you're sure they "will be even better next year. Sounds like you're getting your complaints in early.

 

[DripDrop]

Yes. P-R 2017 would be one.

I think you’re a little biased. NA has a nice team this year, but I don’t think anyone is talking about them being an all time great WPIAL team.

From my viewpoint after watching, NA needs way more playmakers. Your best, Boyd disappeared. Particularly after Jones ran him over on the first TD. QB is a nice player but can’t dominate. Find playmakers and a way to get them the ball.

I disagree new 17 pine Richland was talented and one of the best in wpial history but would get startched on the field to this years prep team. This prep team is the best in piaa tournament history. The talent level they have is crazy. Most PR played both ways. This prep team no goes both ways and no drop off in talent. Outside of jurkovich, kadic, and kristofic they had a bunch of good high school players. Prep had 8 D1 guys in the senior class alone and junior class has five 4 star recruits.

 

[RoverNation05]

You know nothing about the service trips. As I've said on here several times, all SJP students take service trip; some go out of the country. The football team takes one a year; they don't play games or hold practices on the service trips. But for some reason you want to hold on to some ludicrous idea about them.

The have three starters returning on offense, four on defense, but you're sure they "will be even better next year. Sounds like you're getting your complaints in early.

Aren’t they poaching the Germantown Academy quarterback? That’s like half a starter.

 

[RCH13co18]

Aren’t they poaching the Germantown Academy quarterback? That’s like half a starter.

They never went after that kid.

 

[tulla]

Aren’t they poaching the Germantown Academy quarterback? That’s like half a starter.

Rover,

This is the problem. There are so many half-truths and untruths out there that the reality gets obscured. I have no idea if they were "poaching" the GA QB, but I strongly suspect that any interest has been coming from the player and his family. SJP has never had a QB who didn't start as a freshman at SJP since Chris Whitney came in 2004 when his family moved from Kansas City after his father died. Also, if they were to bring in a junior QB he would almost certainly be ineligible for the playoffs next year. And, truth be told, the playoffs mean a lot to SJP.

 

[BradlyPitt]

I thought you would at least acknowledge some of the players like Jones for their performance.

i said they were unbeatable since last year, while others actually thought they could lose

that is more than enough praise

 

[RoverNation05]

Rover,

This is the problem. There are so many half-truths and untruths out there that the reality gets obscured. I have no idea if they were "poaching" the GA QB, but I strongly suspect that any interest has been coming from the player and his family. SJP has never had a QB who didn't start as a freshman at SJP since Chris Whitney came in 2004 when his family moved from Kansas City after his father died. Also, if they were to bring in a junior QB he would almost certainly be ineligible for the playoffs next year. And, truth be told, the playoffs mean a lot to SJP.

I get it, I on a different thread I made an all star team of guys who were rumored to transfer to Easton to wrestle that never happened and never were going to happen. But those rumors happened because we got a shitload of transfers! In a way that did significant damage to LV wrestling on the whole that took years to repair (and cost Easton a decade of their program’s competitiveness).

So now I’m just googling underclassmen on your roster. This Charlie Foulke kid who is a freshman quarterback on your varsity roster already had scholarship offers from Georgia, West Virginia, and Maryland according to his Twitter page? 6’2 180 ninth grader. Assuming he can play a little? From Pittsgrove, NJ, which is 40 miles south of Philly?

 

[BradlyPitt]

Yes. P-R 2017 would be one.

I really don't think so

I think at least 3 SJP teams beat PR 2017

2016, 2020, and 2023

maybe 2022 too

he is biased, but so are you

 

[RoverNation05]

Louie Amiamo probably taking one of the open linebacker spots? Also already holds Power 5 offers despite not starting at SJP yet? From Tabernacle, which is about 30 miles west of Philly, kind of out in the boonies past Medford.

 

[tulla]

I get it, I on a different thread I made an all star team of guys who were rumored to transfer to Easton to wrestle that never happened and never were going to happen. But those rumors happened because we got a shitload of transfers! In a way that did significant damage to LV wrestling on the whole that took years to repair (and cost Easton a decade of their program’s competitiveness).

So now I’m just googling underclassmen on your roster. This Charlie Foulke kid who is a freshman quarterback on your varsity roster already had scholarship offers from Georgia, West Virginia, and Maryland according to his Twitter page? 6’2 180 ninth grader. Assuming he can play a little? From Pittsgrove, NJ, which is 40 miles south of Philly?

I don't put a lot of stock in offers, especially when they're to kids who haven't played a second of varsity football. (I wonder how many other hs QBs have offers from any of those schools.) In fact, I worry some when I see a 13- or 14-year old listing his offers on his Twitter account. A senior administrator at SJP told me a couple of years ago that they tell all the players that offers mean next to nothing. Maybe Foulke will be better than McCord or Jones. Maybe not ...

I've noticed that in the last few years especially SJP has been getting more players from parts of south Jersey that aren't really suburbs of Philly. I'm not sure why that's the case? Higher visibility of the program? Changes within college football that make kids/parents think that playing at SJP will give them a particular advantage? Lack of high quality football teams in south Jersey? (The traditional powers--several of them--are all in the north.) Desire for a more challenging academic environment? Better transportation scheme between their homes and SJP? Probably some mix of a few of these.

 

[BradlyPitt]

I don't put a lot of stock in offers, especially when they're to kids who haven't played a second of varsity football. (I wonder how many other hs QBs have offers from any of those schools.) In fact, I worry some when I see a 13- or 14-year old listing his offers on his Twitter account. A senior administrator at SJP told me a couple of years ago that they tell all the players that offers mean next to nothing. Maybe Foulke will be better than McCord or Jones. Maybe not ...

I've noticed that in the last few years especially SJP has been getting more players from parts of south Jersey that aren't really suburbs of Philly. I'm not sure why that's the case? Higher visibility of the program? Changes within college football that make kids/parents think that playing at SJP will give them a particular advantage? Lack of high quality football teams in south Jersey? (The traditional powers--several of them--are all in the north.) Desire for a more challenging academic environment? Better transportation scheme between their homes and SJP? Probably some mix of a few of these.

imagine how good a kid has to be to get offers before he's in high school

i would rather you gloat about your team dominating then deny your major advantages

 

[RoverNation05]

Up here, the one kid I can remember get a major scholarship offer without playing varsity football was Saquon Barkley when he went to Rutgers camp after his sophomore year. The last time I remember it with you guys was McCord had half the Big Ten and ACC extending him a scholarship before he threw a pass at SJP. Again, worked out pretty well for you.

Is it an accident that SJP is extending so far out past the Philadelphia suburbs in Jersey? I have agreed with you guys that a lot of “they have kids from Jersey” is eye roll stuff, but I was also assuming it was kids from Cherry Hill, Mount Laurel, Haddonfield, Pensauken, etc. But looking at the roster, it’s really not a lot of kids that I’d say are in the natural geographic footprint of SJP that does make me say “what are we doing here?”. And I find it hard to believe that the coaching staff are just passive actors that just see who shows up in August and holy crap we have really good kids from really far away, and wonder how it happened.

 

[tulla]

imagine how good a kid has to be to get offers before he's in high school

i would rather you gloat about your team dominating then deny your major advantages

I don't pretend to understand what goes into offers going to kids before they start high school, but some skepticism seems appropriate.

And I don't deny not having boundaries is a major advantage, but I'll say what many, especially people outside the Philly area, don't get: SJP also has some significant challenges. The advantage of not having borders outweighs the challenges / disadvantages, but thinking it's easy for SJP's team to perform as they do is naive.

It seems to me that recently a number of factors have combined to widen the gap between SJP and other schools in the state: the fact that LaSalle, Judge, and Wood have weakened, the absence of a really strong program in south Jersey (especially among the Catholic high schools there), the impact of having a few former players now in the NFL and a few more in starting/starring roles at high profile colleges, etc. And just maybe certain factors, including demographic ones, have weakened the quality of hs football, in the state. It seems to me that the big schools in D1 are not on the same level as the big schools there were 5, 10, 15, 20 years ago. Anyone disagree? SJP also has an outstanding group of coaches nearly all of whom have been in the program for many years.

 

[RoverNation05]

I’m going to keep pushing because I now find this interesting, not to be a dick.

So I thought the “D1 stinks now” argument may have some merit, but now looking at the SJP starters, their kids from District 1 school districts who play are from Cheltenham, Norristown (2), Haverford, Wissahickon, and Conestoga. None of those programs are any good or have ever been any good, save for one year at Cheltenham recently and a couple years of Norristown in the 90s. The other 16 starters are either NJ or from the city itself. So I’m not sure the decline of District 1 - which really is the decline of the Bucks County schools if we are really breaking it down, is driving SJP jumping to another stratosphere. Other than Marquez McCray, I don’t remember them having kids from North Penn, Neshaminy, Pennsbury, the CBs, etc. Other than Davion Kidd-Jackson, you’re not getting kids from
the Lehigh Valley either, to extend the metaphor.

In general, I think football in the city has gotten significantly better, and SJP has been a huge beneficiary of that. The quality of play 20 years ago has been brought up here, well 20 years ago, so I looked this up. Here are the players from Philly schools in the top 50 (from the 247 composite ratings) in the state 20ish years ago compared to now:

2002: 3
2003: 2
2004: 0
2005: 4
2006: 0
2007: 2
2008: 3
2009: 4
2010: 2
2011: 3
2012: 1
2013: 7
2014: 6
2015: 8
2016: 9
2017: 8
2018: 8
2019: 6
2020: 6
2021: 17
2022: 12
2023: 8
2024: 17

 

[tulla]

I’m going to keep pushing because I now find this interesting, not to be a dick.

So I thought the “D1 stinks now” argument may have some merit, but now looking at the SJP starters, their kids from District 1 school districts who play are from Cheltenham, Norristown (2), Haverford, Wissahickon, and Conestoga. None of those programs are any good or have ever been any good, save for one year at Cheltenham recently and a couple years of Norristown in the 90s. The other 16 starters are either NJ or from the city itself. So I’m not sure the decline of District 1 - which really is the decline of the Bucks County schools if we are really breaking it down, is driving SJP jumping to another stratosphere. Other than Marquez McCray, I don’t remember them having kids from North Penn, Neshaminy, Pennsbury, the CBs, etc. Other than Davion Kidd-Jackson, you’re not getting kids from
the Lehigh Valley either, to extend the metaphor.

In general, I think football in the city has gotten significantly better, and SJP has been a huge beneficiary of that. The quality of play 20 years ago has been brought up here, well 20 years ago, so I looked this up. Here are the players from Philly schools in the top 50 (from the 247 composite ratings) in the state 20ish years ago compared to now:

2002: 3
2003: 2
2004: 0
2005: 4
2006: 0
2007: 2
2008: 3
2009: 4
2010: 2
2011: 3
2012: 1
2013: 7
2014: 6
2015: 8
2016: 9
2017: 8
2018: 8
2019: 6
2020: 6
2021: 17
2022: 12
2023: 8
2024: 17

Rover, I'm not suggesting that the quality of the D1 teams has declined because SJP has been getting players from those school districts. I don't think SJP, in fact, is much of a factor. Maybe fewer kids in suburban districts are playing football. Maybe school boards are less supportive of athletics, maybe especially football. I really don't know, but since you refer specifically to the Bucks County schools, I'd say that we haven't seen anything like the many strong NP teams or the strong Neshaminy or Pennsbury teams--not to mention the legendary CBW team--in recent years. I agree with you that SJP has played little if any role in all this.

That list of yours looks awfully strange to me. With all those very good SJP teams of the first decade of the century--including the '03 team that many thought was one of the best in the country--and the very good teams from O'Hara, Roman (at least in 2007), George Washington (at least in 2008) and LaSalle from '08 to '12, it's hard to believe there were so very few top players from Philly schools.

 

[northalleghenytiger]

Yes. P-R 2017 would be one.

I think you’re a little biased. NA has a nice team this year, but I don’t think anyone is talking about them being an all time great WPIAL team.

From my viewpoint after watching, NA needs way more playmakers. Your best, Boyd disappeared. Particularly after Jones ran him over on the first TD. QB is a nice player but can’t dominate. Find playmakers and a way to get them the ball.

As good as that 2017 pine team was, they wouldn’t be able to touch this St. joes team. How many on that team would start on the hawks, maybe 3? Like I said, this prep team was the greatest high school team I’ve ever seen live, and i don’t think it’s particularly close. 20 D1 players is just simply too much for any public school to overcome

In case you think I’m bashing PR, the NA state champions teams would also get wrecked by these SJP teams. Watching them live really opened my eyes to how dominant they really are

Yes some more playmakers would be nice, but we needed more than that to even make that game competitive

 

[DripDrop]

Rover,

This is the problem. There are so many half-truths and untruths out there that the reality gets obscured. I have no idea if they were "poaching" the GA QB, but I strongly suspect that any interest has been coming from the player and his family. SJP has never had a QB who didn't start as a freshman at SJP since Chris Whitney came in 2004 when his family moved from Kansas City after his father died. Also, if they were to bring in a junior QB he would almost certainly be ineligible for the playoffs next year. And, truth be told, the playoffs mean a lot to SJP.

What about the other potions?

 

[DripDrop]

I get it, I on a different thread I made an all star team of guys who were rumored to transfer to Easton to wrestle that never happened and never were going to happen. But those rumors happened because we got a shitload of transfers! In a way that did significant damage to LV wrestling on the whole that took years to repair (and cost Easton a decade of their program’s competitiveness).

So now I’m just googling underclassmen on your roster. This Charlie Foulke kid who is a freshman quarterback on your varsity roster already had scholarship offers from Georgia, West Virginia, and Maryland according to his Twitter page? 6’2 180 ninth grader. Assuming he can play a little? From Pittsgrove, NJ, which is 40 miles south of Philly?

Imagine that

 

[RoverNation05]

Rover, I'm not suggesting that the quality of the D1 teams has declined because SJP has been getting players from those school districts. I don't think SJP, in fact, is much of a factor. Maybe fewer kids in suburban districts are playing football. Maybe school boards are less supportive of athletics, maybe especially football. I really don't know, but since you refer specifically to the Bucks County schools, I'd say that we haven't seen anything like the many strong NP teams or the strong Neshaminy or Pennsbury teams--not to mention the legendary CBW team--in recent years. I agree with you that SJP has played little if any role in all this.

That list of yours looks awfully strange to me. With all those very good SJP teams of the first decade of the century--including the '03 team that many thought was one of the best in the country--and the very good teams from O'Hara, Roman (at least in 2007), George Washington (at least in 2008) and LaSalle from '08 to '12, it's hard to believe there were so very few top players from Philly schools.

It’s all publicly available data - I’m not going to copy and paste 20 links, but here’s the list from 2004, so the senior class in 2003: https://247sports.com/Season/2004-F...ankings/?InstitutionGroup=highschool&State=PA

That 2003 SJP team only had four FBS players, none rated higher than a two star - Brian Tracz was the #76 player in the state, unranked nationally (and transferred down to Fordham to play), Steve Quinn was #48 in the state, they were the only two Power 5 kids. Matt Parkhurst was a two star, #78 and played at Marshall, and Charlie Noonan transferred out to Lower Merion, but was a two star and the #49 player in the state and went to the Big East version of Rutgers. In terms of talent, not in the same stratosphere as the current run. They did have 7 kids who played FCS football, including four Patriot League and an Ivy League kid, Delaware, and Northern Iowa. Then a sprinkling of D3s. For context, that North Penn team had one top 50 player in the state too, and only two kids who played FBS football.

And that was the formula for all of the best teams in the state. You had one or two FBS studs, because those really are randomly distributed, it’s essentially an accident of genetics, then you were really good when you could surround them with good football players who who could play some level of college football. You hit a critical mass of that, and you might win a state title. What SJP has done over the last decade is say “what if we just made the whole plane out of the FBS studs?”

LaSalle I don’t think produced a Power 5 player in the 2000s. The 2009 team famously is the only state champ without anybody who played FBS football, their superstar was a two star, the #42 player in Pa in 2011, and played at Villanova. The only FBS player LaSalle had in that 2008-2012 run was their punter, who went to Pitt. He was a three star and #39 in the state in the class of 2013. I’m not saying they weren’t good high school teams, they were, but they were pretty regular high school teams. That’s why that LaSalle run is one state title and two finals in five years, with the only state loss to the PPL champ thrown in, and not seven titles and nine finals in ten years. LaSalle also isn’t in the city.

George Washington has had two top 50 players - Shariff Floyd (Florida) was a five star, the top player in the state and the #6 player nationally in 2010, and Jerry Butler (Wisconsin) was #15 in the state in 2005. That’s it for ranked players, and I think for FBS players too from GW.

O’Hara is also not in the city, but their only top 50 players are Anthony Heygood, Mark Wedderburn, Tom Savage, Matt Lowry, and Corey Brown from that era, all spread out in different classes.

From that 2007 Roman team, they had two of the three top 50 players in the state from Philly.

 

[solfootballfan]

It’s all publicly available data - I’m not going to copy and paste 20 links, but here’s the list from 2004, so the senior class in 2003: https://247sports.com/Season/2004-F...ankings/?InstitutionGroup=highschool&State=PA

That 2003 SJP team only had four FBS players, none rated higher than a two star - Brian Tracz was the #76 player in the state, unranked nationally (and transferred down to Fordham to play), Steve Quinn was #48 in the state, they were the only two Power 5 kids. Matt Parkhurst was a two star, #78 and played at Marshall, and Charlie Noonan transferred out to Lower Merion, but was a two star and the #49 player in the state and went to the Big East version of Rutgers. In terms of talent, not in the same stratosphere as the current run. They did have 7 kids who played FCS football, including four Patriot League and an Ivy League kid, Delaware, and Northern Iowa. Then a sprinkling of D3s. For context, that North Penn team had one top 50 player in the state too, and only two kids who played FBS football.

And that was the formula for all of the best teams in the state. You had one or two FBS studs, because those really are randomly distributed, it’s essentially an accident of genetics, then you were really good when you could surround them with good football players who who could play some level of college football. You hit a critical mass of that, and you might win a state title. What SJP has done over the last decade is say “what if we just made the whole plane out of the FBS studs?”

LaSalle I don’t think produced a Power 5 player in the 2000s. The 2009 team famously is the only state champ without anybody who played FBS football, their superstar was a two star, the #42 player in Pa in 2011, and played at Villanova. The only FBS player LaSalle had in that 2008-2012 run was their punter, who went to Pitt. He was a three star and #39 in the state in the class of 2013. I’m not saying they weren’t good high school teams, they were, but they were pretty regular high school teams. That’s why that LaSalle run is one state title and two finals in five years, with the only state loss to the PPL champ thrown in, and not seven titles and nine finals in ten years. LaSalle also isn’t in the city.

George Washington has had two top 50 players - Shariff Floyd (Florida) was a five star, the top player in the state and the #6 player nationally in 2010, and Jerry Butler (Wisconsin) was #15 in the state in 2005. That’s it for ranked players, and I think for FBS players too from GW.

O’Hara is also not in the city, but their only top 50 players are Anthony Heygood, Mark Wedderburn, Tom Savage, Matt Lowry, and Corey Brown from that era, all spread out in different classes.

From that 2007 Roman team, they had two of the three top 50 players in the state from Philly.

Your are correct Rover. As you noted ten years ago SJP teams were much different than the last few. When you’re there it’s more profound. It is what it is.