LaSalle vs PCC Week 0?

[new2pa]

Funny thing - Walker coached for Palko way back and Palko effectively used QB run from Wildcat to beat SJP. But they also had that little kid at QB who could make plays with his arm. NA 23 didn’t have that option IIRC. PCC definitely didn’t have that in 24.

 

[2020sports]

but they always use the excuse for going to private school that academics are a reason they go there

Peters has two kids going to Stanford and neither one of them looked anything special in the 5 Peters games I saw last year, especially in the PR game where I would argue both looked terrible, the one that just committed within the past day doesn't even look like a D2 kid to me, he's just "tall" and some colleges seem to think that automatically means "potential"

they have another kid with big offers from all over the country, and he was arguably just as invisible as they were, but he too is "tall" and he is more recruited than any of the recent Central kids

so you think Colson Gatten had to go to Central to get noticed instead of staying at Peters?

you don't need to go to private school to get recruited by colleges

you are correct, these kids do not "need to go to private schools." But, usually they are better off. My point, is it's a lower risk, It's a lower gamble to go there- they have a much better track record than every local public school- I'm talking about the "best" kids, Power 4. I'm not sure what you mean that the Peter's kid was "recruited more" than the Central kids is just not true. I'm not a Central booster, or alum, i dont "love them" but they put more kids in big schools, it's really no debate.

In many ways, public/local is better, especially for the "average" or even the "good athletes," which is why i am talking about the 1%, the best kids. Private schools have less rules, more flexibility, which makes it easier for college recuiting. It is very diffcult to build and maintain a successful public school football program in western PA- that is why there are so few of them. Butler, Woodland Hills, Gateway, Lebo, North Hills, even USC- these are schools that "used to be great" and really are no longer- this is why they "lose kids" to transferring. This happens due to shaky coaching, or shaky resources, or a combination.

And again, the "payoff" is now real money, as soon as they graduate high school.

 

[2020sports]

Funny thing - Walker coached for Palko way back and Palko effectively used QB run from Wildcat to beat SJP. But they also had that little kid at QB who could make plays with his arm. NA 23 didn’t have that option IIRC. PCC definitely didn’t have that in 24.

agree- but id argue maybe Palko is just a better coach than Walker!! Walker plays checkers, Palko plays chess. My guess is Palko had spent 2 years building and preparing to beat SJP in 2021

 

[2020sports]

The 23 team had all the talent in the world and couldn’t stop QB power. I thought that was one of Art Walkers best coaching jobs.

IMO the flaws of PCC in 2023 was a reflection of new coaching- that was the first year of the new staff- tough to put all the pieces together, in like 8-9 months

 

[northalleghenytiger]

I wonder how much truth there was about palko and the central catholic HC job a few years ago

 

[2020sports]

I wonder how much truth there was about palko and the central catholic HC job a few years ago

very likely true- he prob asked them for a full time job/big salary, they said no, and that's why he went to penn state- he is a good guy and a great coach- but he has done that before

 

[BradlyPitt]

The 23 team had all the talent in the world and couldn’t stop QB power. I thought that was one of Art Walkers best coaching jobs.

yes but I was actually referring to Ethan Pillar

 

[BradlyPitt]

you are correct, these kids do not "need to go to private schools." But, usually they are better off. My point, is it's a lower risk, It's a lower gamble to go there- they have a much better track record than every local public school- I'm talking about the "best" kids, Power 4. I'm not sure what you mean that the Peter's kid was "recruited more" than the Central kids is just not true. I'm not a Central booster, or alum, i dont "love them" but they put more kids in big schools, it's really no debate.

In many ways, public/local is better, especially for the "average" or even the "good athletes," which is why i am talking about the 1%, the best kids. Private schools have less rules, more flexibility, which makes it easier for college recuiting. It is very diffcult to build and maintain a successful public school football program in western PA- that is why there are so few of them. Butler, Woodland Hills, Gateway, Lebo, North Hills, even USC- these are schools that "used to be great" and really are no longer- this is why they "lose kids" to transferring. This happens due to shaky coaching, or shaky resources, or a combination.

And again, the "payoff" is now real money, as soon as they graduate high school.

Reston Lehman has big offers from everywhere across the country, Peters was always below average in football until 2018 now they regularly have prospects including kids that I don't think are good enough for the next level

Central puts more kids in big schools simply because those kids choose to go there, not because Central has some "secret sauce" that turns these kids into prospects

aside from maybe Butler I don't think there is any proof those schools are lacking resources or anything at all, USC and Lebo aren't lacking anything other than just not having the horses on a consistent basis, Woodland Hills lost a ton of enrollment but it probably doesn't help they choose to play up 2 classes

North Hills has been killed by transfers, Gateway used to benefit more than anybody from transfers in the mid to late 2000's

it's normal to have down years, it's not normal to be in the title game every year for a decade+ ie Central, PR etc the teams that don't have down years are bending the rules and getting transfers

 

[BradlyPitt]

very likely true- he prob asked them for a full time job/big salary, they said no, and that's why he went to penn state- he is a good guy and a great coach- but he has done that before

yeah everybody says he's a good guy, seems like a bit of a phony to me

 

[2020sports]

yes but I was actually referring to Ethan Pillar

Pillar plays at Mercyhurst. IMO, a big reason that PR has beaten PCC several years in a row is an edge in coaching

 

[2020sports]

Reston Lehman has big offers from everywhere across the country, Peters was always below average in football until 2018 now they regularly have prospects including kids that I don't think are good enough for the next level

Central puts more kids in big schools simply because those kids choose to go there, not because Central has some "secret sauce" that turns these kids into prospects

aside from maybe Butler I don't think there is any proof those schools are lacking resources or anything at all, USC and Lebo aren't lacking anything other than just not having the horses on a consistent basis, Woodland Hills lost a ton of enrollment but it probably doesn't help they choose to play up 2 classes

North Hills has been killed by transfers, Gateway used to benefit more than anybody from transfers in the mid to late 2000's

it's normal to have down years, it's not normal to be in the title game every year for a decade+ ie Central, PR etc the teams that don't have down years are bending the rules and getting transfers

BP- im not gonna debate with you- but it's just not accurate to say the "consistent winning" programs in HS football are "cheating and bending rules" to get transfers. It takes a lot more than just talent. Perfect example- Gateway- they have had great talent, but have not even made it to a championship, for like 7-8 years. And, id have to guess, they probably DO bend some rules.

Peters- the big change has been Plack- he's a very good coach, and has developed them into a good program.- good not great. Lebo has had 3 different coaching staffs in the last 3 years- pretty sure most people would say they have shaky coaching.

And Central- again, I'm not gonna debate you- there is more involved than just "putting the kid on the field." They gotta coach and develop the kids, and college recuiters go there, more than some other school in the area- the kids get better exposure. James Franklin, PSU, says "we need more Pittsburgh Central Kids." Pretty sure PSU has never even VISITED maybe 90% of other high schools in Western PA. AND, how NFL? Right now, I think there are like 3-4 kids actively playing in the NFL. That is not fake, or hype.

And- lasty- the idea of what is "normal" in high school sports- it's just so different- high school sports are "not what they were" 30 years ago- just not even the same as 3 years ago... there is just a "new normal." And it kinda seems to be changing year-to-year.

 

[BradlyPitt]

Pillar plays at Mercyhurst. IMO, a big reason that PR has beaten PCC several years in a row is an edge in coaching

ok he is playing somewhere

you would think Central with all of their alleged talent, which some on this forum thought might be the best WPIAL team ever, and their top coaching staff could've figured out how to stop a Mercyhurt kid

 

[BradlyPitt]

BP- im not gonna debate with you- but it's just not accurate to say the "consistent winning" programs in HS football are "cheating and bending rules" to get transfers. It takes a lot more than just talent. Perfect example- Gateway- they have had great talent, but have not even made it to a championship, for like 7-8 years. And, id have to guess, they probably DO bend some rules.

Peters- the big change has been Plack- he's a very good coach, and has developed them into a good program.- good not great. Lebo has had 3 different coaching staffs in the last 3 years- pretty sure most people would say they have shaky coaching.

And Central- again, I'm not gonna debate you- there is more involved than just "putting the kid on the field." They gotta coach and develop the kids, and college recuiters go there, more than some other school in the area- the kids get better exposure. James Franklin, PSU, says "we need more Pittsburgh Central Kids." Pretty sure PSU has never even VISITED maybe 90% of other high schools in Western PA. AND, how NFL? Right now, I think there are like 3-4 kids actively playing in the NFL. That is not fake, or hype.

And- lasty- the idea of what is "normal" in high school sports- it's just so different- high school sports are "not what they were" 30 years ago- just not even the same as 3 years ago... there is just a "new normal." And it kinda seems to be changing year-to-year.

Gateway won WPIAL 5A in 2019

how is Peters not a great program?

2018 - semifinal loss after having the lead to Penn Hills, which won the state
2019 - close loss to Gateway in WPIAL final
2020 - mercy rule loss to PR in WPIAL title game, I think that PR team is arguably the best WPIAL team of the last 7 years or so
2021 - 2nd round playoff loss to PR
2022 - missed playoffs with only 3 losses, the system has since changed to prevent teams like that from being left out
2023 - WPIAL champ, state runner up
2024 - WPIAL runner u[

on top of that they are now regularly putting kids in D1 schools, Ivy league etc how is this not a great program?

I don't understand you saying Central coaches aren't as good as PR but then you argue Central's coaches develop their kids

of course recruiters go there, they are an all star team

 

[2020sports]

Gateway won WPIAL 5A in 2019

how is Peters not a great program?

2018 - semifinal loss after having the lead to Penn Hills, which won the state
2019 - close loss to Gateway in WPIAL final
2020 - mercy rule loss to PR in WPIAL title game, I think that PR team is arguably the best WPIAL team of the last 7 years or so
2021 - 2nd round playoff loss to PR
2022 - missed playoffs with only 3 losses, the system has since changed to prevent teams like that from being left out
2023 - WPIAL champ, state runner up
2024 - WPIAL runner u[

on top of that they are now regularly putting kids in D1 schools, Ivy league etc how is this not a great program?

I don't understand you saying Central coaches aren't as good as PR but then you argue Central's coaches develop their kids

of course recruiters go there, they are an all star team

uh ok, so it's been 6 years since Gateway played in a championship- not 7.

Yes, agreed the run for Peters has been impressive, good program. Cannot throw out the "great" term often

 

[BradlyPitt]

uh ok, so it's been 6 years since Gateway played in a championship- not 7.

Yes, agreed the run for Peters has been impressive, good program. Cannot throw out the "great" term often

it's been 5 years, year 6 didn't start yet, though they probably won't win it next year

4 championship appearances in 6 seasons, that is great

what is great to you?

 

[2020sports]

it's been 5 years, year 6 didn't start yet, though they probably won't win it next year

4 championship appearances in 6 seasons, that is great

what is great to you?

yer funny- splitting hairs, on 5 or 6 years for gateway? The other issue w them, is they have won zero playoff games in the last 4 years.

ok, now Peters- sorry, but champions are not the "second best." Peters is a good program, not great. They a "great year" in 23. Ok, maybe they are a "great South hills team?" But seriously- great programs would be the "best of the best" meaning state champs, or repeat WPIAL winners. Peters is a text-book program, to have benefited from our "watered down" 6 levels- if we had only 4, they might have played 6A for some years, and certainly would have played in less WPIAL finals and maybe not have made it to the state final. And yes (before you even say it!) maybe PR has benefited from the 6 class system- but so too have some others, locally and state-wide.

So now, the "great" programs in the last 10 years, locally? Sure, we could debate this, but I'd say TJ, Aliquippa, CV, PCC, PR, and maybe Clairton. Maybe I could add more to this list? Sure, but then, the more you add the more you water it down.