I agree with the majority of what you said, but the reason as to why PR isn’t “nationally known” anymore is an event that took place a year before the coach was fired. 12/5/19
was the date of pines “fading popularity”
St. Joseph's Prep 2020 vs. _________
- Thread starter RoverNation05
- Start date
was the date of pines “fading popularity”
IIRC PR was to play again on national TV at Rutgers stadium to open 2020. Then Covid hit. Pretty sure they were popular.
AND - the folks who were most happy about that was North Allegheny. Got mercy ruled by P-R twice in 2019 and P-R practically begged to play NA when WPIAL scheduled, but NA wouldn’t. PCC did. SV did. NA nope.
Your AD: “There’s no advantage for us to play a 5A team,” Bozzuto said. Pretty presumptive for a team that hadn’t won in almost a decade.
tribhssn.triblive.com
Your AD: “There’s no advantage for us to play a 5A team,” Bozzuto said. Pretty presumptive for a team that hadn’t won in almost a decade.
North Allegheny AD Bozzuto sees future Class 6A football alignment with larger field | Trib HSSN
North Allegheny athletic director Bob Bozzuto has a forward-thinking mindset when it comes to football conference realignment. The ink barely has dried on WPIAL plans for the next two seasons, but he’s ready to start thinking about 2024 and ’25.
tribhssn.triblive.com
Lol keep that same energy when you guys get clapped again
A thousand kids more than pine yet they have the same amount of state titles in 6 years than NA has in their entire existence. They do it again this year and are moved up, you’ll get your wish alright, NA will surely never even come close to winning again with a lehmier PCC squad and pr in the same conference 🤡
Who were they supposed to play? They most likely were coasting off the success they had at 6A if they were scheduled to play at Rutgers. The move down to 5A started the descent, Coach Ks firing was “the final blow” so to speak
I 100% agree with Bozzuto. I’m glad we played Pickering Central and Erie McDowell. If possible, 6A should play 6A. If PR wanted to play NA so bad they should have stayed upAND - the folks who were most happy about that was North Allegheny. Got mercy ruled by P-R twice in 2019 and P-R practically begged to play NA when WPIAL scheduled, but NA wouldn’t. PCC did. SV did. NA nope.
Your AD: “There’s no advantage for us to play a 5A team,” Bozzuto said. Pretty presumptive for a team that hadn’t won in almost a decade.
North Allegheny AD Bozzuto sees future Class 6A football alignment with larger field | Trib HSSN
North Allegheny athletic director Bob Bozzuto has a forward-thinking mindset when it comes to football conference realignment. The ink barely has dried on WPIAL plans for the next two seasons, but he’s ready to start thinking about 2024 and ’25.
Oh brother get a load of this guy. Listen buddy, Pine only has ONE title at the highest level. The other 2 were in 5A. 2020 they were GIFTED a ring due to coronavirus. Erie Cathedral prep was a terrible opponent, they got there via forfeits. We are not the same.
Lehmeir PCC squad? Give me a break. He was mediocre at best during his time at Seneca.
tiger- jeez, you are just so far off in your perspective- PR being "lower profile" has very little to do with playing 5A. NA is HAPPY to play 6A, and happy with playing in a bogus level- a championship" among 5 teams- its their only chance to win a championship- playing for WPIAL 6A championship is a joke
and maybe New- i think you said 1000 more kids? nope, NA is literally twice the size of PR- 4000 kids compared to 8000. Sure, yea, if PR played 6A, they may have to play SJP- but I can gurantee- PR folks respect SJP, but we are not scared of SJP. 6A is a jacked up conference, just not enough local schools- 5A recently has been great competiion- with 4 of the last state champs coming from Pittsburgh area.
Bogus level? You’re out to lunch. Playing 5A teams does NOTHING for us. We won’t see any of them in the playoffs. That’s why we scheduled McDowell.
It’s easy to not be “scared” of SJP from a PRs fan perspective, because you guys have no chance at playing them again. SJP doesnt play 5A schools
wow- i kinda feel sorry for you tiger- whether we call it bogus, meaningless or maybe "not impressive" i am pretty sure if we asked 100 WPIAL football coaches, if asked, "what would be the easiest level to win?" they would say 6A. It's FIVE TEAMS. It really is meaningless. And, again, yes SJP is a big deal, but state- wide? The whole level is not very strong. And... again... this is all really meaningless for NA cuz they could not even make it past the first round in the state playoffs. That is sad and weak- and a poor representation for WPIAL. And you are bragging about who you schedule? Wow, Alderdice and McDowell???? omg, those are bogus opponents, if this program thinks it is "great." No, like i have said in many previous posts, NA Football is a "has-been" Walker is a good coach not great. He is making 130 thousand dollars, and he wants to win locally, have a winning record, and maybe win another bogus/meaninless/not impressive "title." I would be surprised if PCC does not mop them up, play them twice this year and beat them, a sum total of like 70-14
And- not being scared of SJP?? that whole conversation is meaningless for NA... NA does not need to be scared of them either- cuz they will never win enough to get to play them!!!
They've played schools smaller then 6A.
St. Francis would be a 2A school in PA based on enrollment alone
Archbishop Wood is 5A
Roman is 5A
Erasmus Hall would be a 2A type school in PA
Middletown would probably be 5A in PA
Not playing 5A was just convenient way to get out of playing their closest rival who would have Mercy ruled them another couple times.
However, I believe this year the WPIAL isn't having any of it and scheduled them to play during the regular season.
I expect NA to give them a thumping this time around.
However, I believe this year the WPIAL isn't having any of it and scheduled them to play during the regular season.
I expect NA to give them a thumping this time around.
I like that "Can do" Sammy attitude.
There was a time when that was pervasive across all across the Commonwealth -- and it was great!
Maybe that's all gone.
But pontificating yet again -- as long as the arrangement remains the same in PA it's gonna be St. Joe's (in almost every season) roaring out of the East to take down the West 4 out of 5 times (there will be the occasional upstart "special" senior laden/talent rich team that will catch a young Hawk's group during a "down" year and win but that will be the oddball year).
Anyway, so as long as everyone is A=OK with that set up we're good.
Hmmmm - the "Sammy" approach ... got to be a way to make that a reality.
We start by going to 5 classifications (and I think 4 are just fine but it's a start).
There was a time when that was pervasive across all across the Commonwealth -- and it was great!
Maybe that's all gone.
But pontificating yet again -- as long as the arrangement remains the same in PA it's gonna be St. Joe's (in almost every season) roaring out of the East to take down the West 4 out of 5 times (there will be the occasional upstart "special" senior laden/talent rich team that will catch a young Hawk's group during a "down" year and win but that will be the oddball year).
Anyway, so as long as everyone is A=OK with that set up we're good.
Hmmmm - the "Sammy" approach ... got to be a way to make that a reality.
We start by going to 5 classifications (and I think 4 are just fine but it's a start).
How does going to 5 or 4 classes help the rest of the state become more relevant to SJP?
Harrisburg and state college are strong. Just because WPIAL 6a is down, doesn’t mean it’s not still the best classification in the state. I don’t understand how your content with being 5A. You beat SJP, then 2 years later you move down. That’s what made Mt. Lebanon and Pine so special. They “derailed” the dynasty. Now Palko is gone and pine moved. Make it make sense
70-14? Don’t tell me you’re overrating PCC like you did seneca last year
I disagree with that theory. True, maybe pine would have mercy ruled us in 2020, but in 2021 we probably mercy rule you. You beat us in 2022, and we’ll probably beat you in 2023. It’s a pretty even series IMO
im not sying i diasgree- New- but who are you saying "I expect NA to give them a thumping?" you mean NA gonna thump PR?
ok, yes i and others "overrated" Seneca in '22. So, yes, pls feel free to remind me (respectfully!!!) if I am wrong after this fall, I might be wrong. But seriously PCC has a much better "program" than Seneca, and they have much better talent- no one can disagree with that.
"you move down" to 5A is just ridiculous and not true. the state moved PR down. I have said this in the past, and I am pretty sure no school in the whole friggin state has chosen to "play up" to 6A. Just dumb for a bunch of reason. The main reason Pr "stayed at 5" was b/c we could play local 5A rivals. And, yea, maybe, did not want to face SJP- what school in the right mind WOULD.
and a "gift of a ring in 2020" that is ridiculous, off base, not accurate- yes a different weird year, but not a "gift"
They weren’t gifted a ring lol you are funny. Go talk to governor mifflin and nick singleton, I’m sure they just blew it in the semi’s on purpose to help PR. Get real.
Not everything is black and white like your pea brain thinks. Schools can punch above their size all the time. Your comment is funny because 5A PR smoked NA last year. NA wouldn’t win 6A, 5A, or 4A. PR is 5A by enrollment and that’s where they are classified by the wpial and Piaa. This is not a difficult concept to grasp. The only school PR would have problems with in 6A is SJP. Nobody is worried about NA.
Seneca valley isn’t exactly a football powerhouse, pcc has much better talent and tradition. They will see success with lehmier I guarantee.
I think four or five--rather than six--classifications would help high school football overall in PA. There simply aren't enough schools in each classification in most parts of the state, e.g, low number of 6A schools in the WPIAL, low number of 1A and 2A schools in SE PA, low number of 6A (and 5A?) schools in NE PA, i.e. north of D11, etc.
Smoked is an interesting word choice. 28-17. You’ll be eating your words when NA wins by 3+ tds this upcoming year
“the only school PR would have problems with in 6A is SJP”. This madness must be stopped. Hate to break it to you but if PR was in 6A, they would have ended the same as NA. State college, Harrisburg, SJP, and lasalle were all better than PR last year
2020: Ya I think this may be NAs year. LR has two OL back (Cory, Putzuk) and a couple nice LB’s in young Heckert and Johnson. After Pillar at RB (who likely needs to play both ways) and perhaps the young Wentz kid, I worry about their skill players. This will be the first time in a decade their QB play is likely average. (Huffman or Beam I guess - Spencer out permanently)
Anyway, I think they will be very good again in 5A. Semis if finals, but think NA and PCC could give them issues that they have no answer for in terms of talent and size.
Anyway, I think they will be very good again in 5A. Semis if finals, but think NA and PCC could give them issues that they have no answer for in terms of talent and size.
so, in 2022 PR beat PCC and NA the "two best" teams this year from WPIAL 6A sum total of 53-30, and we "would not have gone very far???"
Man, tiger, you just must not follow sports very closely, or don't understand what makes a "championship football team."
I'm gonna stop this debate with you- and maybe all other debates with you... as the quote goes-
"Never argue with an idiot. You'll never convince the idiot that you're correct, and bystanders won't be able to tell who's who."
a) A year ago you said NA would beat SJP in the state final
b) Myself and several others a year ago said Seneca would really good, and be the "best of the 5 teams in wpial"
Pretty sure, most PA HS football fans could determine which of these statements was more idiodic. And, again, im pretty sure most Pa HS football people would say in Dec 2022, the best team in Pa was SJP and the second best team in PA, at that time was PR
How does moving to less classifications help?
Well ... in the olden days (pre-playoffs) there was more or less one class and then at some point, I believe, you were either a big school or a small school (with all of that just sort of "recognized"). They did split out All State selections that way for a while (I believe).
Then the playoffs start in 1988 and suddenly there are 4 classes with each group consisting of about 125 to 150 schools (I want to say there were about 600 schools in PA participating in 1988).
And initially there was just the four team set up with two teams from the East and two from the West in each class (so two extra games). That then more or less evolved into 5 playoff games (so that with what became a ten game regular season - for pretty much everyone - and another 5 through the state final a team could expect a 15 game season if they made it all the way - with some exceptions of course).
That was the landscape from 1988 until 2016 when it went to six classes (so there were 28 years of four classes).
IDK -- somehow 125 teams per class seemed about right. Why? Can't say for certain but it did (100 a class seems light). Six classes just seems to thin it out too much (especially in the WPIAL). Not enough schools to flesh it out.
Plus when you have 100 schools per class you're starting off the playoffs with about 1/3 of all the schools in a class -- 1/3?!? At least with 4 classes it's about 1/4 or less of all the teams in a particular group and honestly -- even at 1/4 or less of all the schools in a class that's plenty of participation. (and some weak sisters making it in).
Six classes just seems to be watered down too much.
Just a feeling.
Well ... in the olden days (pre-playoffs) there was more or less one class and then at some point, I believe, you were either a big school or a small school (with all of that just sort of "recognized"). They did split out All State selections that way for a while (I believe).
Then the playoffs start in 1988 and suddenly there are 4 classes with each group consisting of about 125 to 150 schools (I want to say there were about 600 schools in PA participating in 1988).
And initially there was just the four team set up with two teams from the East and two from the West in each class (so two extra games). That then more or less evolved into 5 playoff games (so that with what became a ten game regular season - for pretty much everyone - and another 5 through the state final a team could expect a 15 game season if they made it all the way - with some exceptions of course).
That was the landscape from 1988 until 2016 when it went to six classes (so there were 28 years of four classes).
IDK -- somehow 125 teams per class seemed about right. Why? Can't say for certain but it did (100 a class seems light). Six classes just seems to thin it out too much (especially in the WPIAL). Not enough schools to flesh it out.
Plus when you have 100 schools per class you're starting off the playoffs with about 1/3 of all the schools in a class -- 1/3?!? At least with 4 classes it's about 1/4 or less of all the teams in a particular group and honestly -- even at 1/4 or less of all the schools in a class that's plenty of participation. (and some weak sisters making it in).
Six classes just seems to be watered down too much.
Just a feeling.
Last edited:
regarding NA- maybe closer game, not sure yet of winner
PR will be good, not sure how good- im gonna revive other post- PR 23
I think State College and definitely Harrisburg could've beaten PR last year
PR absolutely wanted to avoid SJP, that is why they were happy to go to 5A
PR absolutely wanted to avoid SJP, that is why they were happy to go to 5A
How about st Joe preps two former player now with the Eagles. Swift and Zacheus were a great tandem for the Prep.
Very exciting to have the two local guys, especially for us Prep people.
Both have already had longer than average NFL careers. (I think the average is just under three years.) The issue with Swift is injuries. Going back to his senior year at SJP, he's missed games because of injuries in six of his last seven seasons. I suspect that was the reason he was a second round rather than a first round pick by the Lions. Maybe it has something about the way he plays the game, i.e., he's hits hard and sometimes tries to run through people rather than run out of bounds. If he can stay healthy, he'll be one of the league's best backs.
Sjp is a football factory. They have a lot of talent in the NFL. I believe the 2013 team has 3 NFL players right now. I think we will see McCord, Harrison, and trotter playing in the NFL as well. Marvin Harrison is the best college receiver and will be a first round pick.
That 2013 team was interesting, Marin was their qb, a real gamer, maybe 5”9, average arm, tough runner but not a speed burner, Had a banged up knee down the stretch, just a feel for the game and a knack of making the big play. The Neshaminy game was a battle. I forget the score but Neshaminy was in it for sure , then that rip and strip inside the SJP 10 that went the distance for 6 the other way for 90 plus yards for the prep was huge. They then got a big stop for a punt and Marin threw a dime to I think O for a back breaker. Neshaminy had no pass game so that was really all she wrote after that…
Wood won it all that year in 5a and prep won by 10 , lasalle was loaded that year and prep won by 7 and then in 2nd game by 10, parkland was outstanding with soph d1 prospect delvonte cross and a 1600 yard rb, forget his name, stifled them, matin threw for 250 on one knee. They lost to don Bosco real bad in game 2 who was really loaded, saw bosco live that year, a real machine with d1 dudes everywhere. Lost to Malvern prep that year late in the year who always have alot of talent but did not see that game or expect that outcome at all but they managed to regroup and rebound after a big loss. They had one tough ass schedule and beat some real high end top quality opponents along the way. Too me extremely impressive state title playing close or closer games many weeks, lost and came back to win it all. . Add pgh cc who had a plethora of d1 talent. Losing by 3 at half I think, adjusted and whooped them in the 2nd half. Swift was a freshman I believe but you could see he was going to be great even then. I thought it was one of those years that was extremely strong out east and they battled through for the title. To beat a real deal of a team in Pgh cc. One of my favorite years to watch competitive football!
Wood won it all that year in 5a and prep won by 10 , lasalle was loaded that year and prep won by 7 and then in 2nd game by 10, parkland was outstanding with soph d1 prospect delvonte cross and a 1600 yard rb, forget his name, stifled them, matin threw for 250 on one knee. They lost to don Bosco real bad in game 2 who was really loaded, saw bosco live that year, a real machine with d1 dudes everywhere. Lost to Malvern prep that year late in the year who always have alot of talent but did not see that game or expect that outcome at all but they managed to regroup and rebound after a big loss. They had one tough ass schedule and beat some real high end top quality opponents along the way. Too me extremely impressive state title playing close or closer games many weeks, lost and came back to win it all. . Add pgh cc who had a plethora of d1 talent. Losing by 3 at half I think, adjusted and whooped them in the 2nd half. Swift was a freshman I believe but you could see he was going to be great even then. I thought it was one of those years that was extremely strong out east and they battled through for the title. To beat a real deal of a team in Pgh cc. One of my favorite years to watch competitive football!
That was one of the more competitive years and looked like a lot of teams could have won it. That started Sjp dominance for a decade plus. I think Sjp national schedule is a giant advantage for them. It not only prepares them for the playoffs but also brings In the talent knowing that you're a high school kid and will be playing on ESPN on national tv. I think I read where other schools Nevada are trying to ban bishop Gorman from doing this because the talent on their team is become so lopsided form the rest of the state. We are seeing this in sjp as well. I heard Sjp could have as many as 15 d1 guys.
Last edited:
Hauss- Winning does it all. I have been around the block. Philly and Pgh. Your an Erie prep guy. We played Erie prep every preseason when Mina George was coach.(131-44) Why? They were always loaded and good. Why? They had top academics and top football, a way to get a scholarship as a kid/family. A couple college teammates of mine played at Erie prep so I know the deal. Were they recruited because they were good athletes? Yes. Both were good students. Were they recruited for academics? Yes. Win win right?
In Pgh you got Pgh CC and at a much smaller level North Catholic. In Harrisburg you have McDevitt, In Philly you have the most choices. PCL and the Inter act which is loaded with talent. A lot of schools to choose from, kids in Pa go over bridge to nj to Notre dame and Hun school.Lasalle, Roman, Penn charter, wood, list is long and the leagues were close and tough , week in and week out. Now PCL schools closed and closing. So that changed things. Sjp had some great teams, years under brooks(he was a little nutty) infante to me brought it to next level because he related to kids and they wanted to play for him and staff. One of my sons was maybe a freshman and his hs beat sjp by a lot and when he was a sr in 2013 his team was good , lost to prep by a lot but about the same as Pgh cc so it was different times period. Football is losing kids and watered down. The game has changed and so has the landscape. PR beat them, Lebo beat them and it will happen again. Lasalle and Roman will beat prep as they have done in the past, things go on circles so it will come around at some point. Don bosco beat the pants off prep and then they had some lean years (by their standards)again comes around. Wood was a total power and now in a bad place after Devlin rolled, again goes in circles. Wpial is down and that concerns me, 5 team shit show in 6A concerns me, a mediocre upper st clair team in 5a finals last year concerns me. North penn having so much talent in 6A but won’t play defense baffles me. Numbers are down so I hope when my grandkids play I get to watch some good football!
In Pgh you got Pgh CC and at a much smaller level North Catholic. In Harrisburg you have McDevitt, In Philly you have the most choices. PCL and the Inter act which is loaded with talent. A lot of schools to choose from, kids in Pa go over bridge to nj to Notre dame and Hun school.Lasalle, Roman, Penn charter, wood, list is long and the leagues were close and tough , week in and week out. Now PCL schools closed and closing. So that changed things. Sjp had some great teams, years under brooks(he was a little nutty) infante to me brought it to next level because he related to kids and they wanted to play for him and staff. One of my sons was maybe a freshman and his hs beat sjp by a lot and when he was a sr in 2013 his team was good , lost to prep by a lot but about the same as Pgh cc so it was different times period. Football is losing kids and watered down. The game has changed and so has the landscape. PR beat them, Lebo beat them and it will happen again. Lasalle and Roman will beat prep as they have done in the past, things go on circles so it will come around at some point. Don bosco beat the pants off prep and then they had some lean years (by their standards)again comes around. Wood was a total power and now in a bad place after Devlin rolled, again goes in circles. Wpial is down and that concerns me, 5 team shit show in 6A concerns me, a mediocre upper st clair team in 5a finals last year concerns me. North penn having so much talent in 6A but won’t play defense baffles me. Numbers are down so I hope when my grandkids play I get to watch some good football!
Good points Soup. 2A Trinity in Shiremanstown-Camp Hill (D3) on the West Shore across from Harrisburg is resurrecting under Coach Jordan Hill. See below. They aren't going to replace McDevitt any time soon but are on the path to achieve the success they've had in the past very soon and are presently ahead of schedule.
Reached high last year playing Roman Catholic and Wyomissing giving the guys a taste! The Harrisburg area has a TON of talent to tap into.
Get to know Trinity head football coach Jordan Hill
Mr. Jordan Hill is the head football coach of the Trinity High School Shamrocks, a position he took in the spring of last year.
bvmsports.com