Things certainly look to be getting worse with respect to competitiveness. Usually either Judge or Roman gives SJP a very competitive game--and it wasn't so long ago that Judge or Roman would occasionally beat SJP--but this year the games were over by the middle of the first quarter. And it's not just the pool of talented players that's getting shallower but the pool of kids willing to come to practice and suit up that's is getting smaller too. Carroll and Roman cancelled their JV games against SJP and I'll be astonished if Judge fields a JV team tomorrow.
PCL Red
- Thread starter tulla
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It will get even worse when the feeder schools start drying up. Parents are holding their kids back from playing at an alarming rate. CYO ball is struggling to keep teams together. My son played on a CYO team that, at the time was made up of 5 parishes when in the past those 5 parishes fielded teams on their own. The same team is now hanging on. And it was no secret that that team was a direct pipeline to La Salle.
Tulla, I looked at this yesterday. SJP, LS, and AW have beaten AC, FJ, AR, and RC a combined 470-to-71, or 42.7 to 6.5. Ten of the eleven games have been a mercy rule and the one non-mercy rule was LS 34-0 over Judge. Only SJP vs AC remains.
I've have been at SJP vs RC/FJ the last two weeks and I have never seen either programs numbers be this low.
Self fulfilling prophecy at both levels. As Prep, Wood, LaSalle programs improved at hyperspeed to win states and compete nationally the other teams in the division are left behind. It's not some grand trend of less players playing. It's about kids and parents making decisions about where the kids will play.
Realistically only the absolute best players can get on the field at those programs. In fact each program has kids on the sidelines who don't see the field that would be two way studs at their prospective home district programs. So it's a decision a kid has to make if they will ever be good enough to play. Second no one is very excited at the prospect of playing at Carroll, Judge, Ryan or Roman knowing you have zero chance of winning your league or even three of your games. Some people would say it's on the schools/coaches to get better. Maybe true. However where that starts is with a very substantial budget provided by boosters to get in the game. Easier said then done. Often money spent on one class and then not sustainable year after year. To be really successful the budget has to be LARGE to get and keep players. The big three will get full payers because of their status. Not too many big time players dying to enroll and the secondary programs without assistance. So you have the current situation.
Everyone talks about progress at Carroll. They have made progress. But lets not act like they are beating out the likes of Prep for kids Preps really wants consistently. They are getting the next tier and paying them. Still getting beat by 40. Luckily their numbers are way down and they will go down to Blue next year and do well with these sophs there. If in the Red it would be more of the same.
CYO also a self fulfilling prophecy. It's not less kids willing to play. It's less kids willing to play in an all star league of conglomerate teams and get destroyed. CYO has become the place where every kid that has a high school recruitment aspiration finds a way into the league regardless of religious or parish affiliation. The team that has won it last two years had 13 affiliated parishes, a footprint that crosses about eight school districts and zero standards as to who is eligible. They are playing two parish programs whose priest only allows Catholic kids and covers about 2 square miles. So pretty soon no one wants to play for the true CYO team and get killed by an AAU team. Then you end up with 20 AAU teams where only the best kids go to Prep, Wood and LaSalle and the rest filter back to public schools, inter ac and occasionally catholic schools. So CYO destroyed itself. In a quest to field teams they created a situation where playing field totally different and teams doing it the old way found themselves eliminated from relevance. Now the exact same nonsense happening at NG. The aforementioned CYO program that won the last two seasons had to fold mid season three years ago. Throw the standards out the window, make it about winning and getting the best kids at all cost and then bingo you go from out of business to championships. It's a total farce and a joke.
Participation will be an issue in future but that isn't the problem right now in Catholic League. Problem is top heavy league now in both divisions with the NG AAU team and the fact that no one wants to pay 10 grand to go play in a program where you can't win or compete some weeks. There are more Catholic kids playing at public schools than ever before. Throughout Delaware and Chester County kids that would have played at catholic schools are all over every districts roster. It's not changing anytime soon either.
Realistically only the absolute best players can get on the field at those programs. In fact each program has kids on the sidelines who don't see the field that would be two way studs at their prospective home district programs. So it's a decision a kid has to make if they will ever be good enough to play. Second no one is very excited at the prospect of playing at Carroll, Judge, Ryan or Roman knowing you have zero chance of winning your league or even three of your games. Some people would say it's on the schools/coaches to get better. Maybe true. However where that starts is with a very substantial budget provided by boosters to get in the game. Easier said then done. Often money spent on one class and then not sustainable year after year. To be really successful the budget has to be LARGE to get and keep players. The big three will get full payers because of their status. Not too many big time players dying to enroll and the secondary programs without assistance. So you have the current situation.
Everyone talks about progress at Carroll. They have made progress. But lets not act like they are beating out the likes of Prep for kids Preps really wants consistently. They are getting the next tier and paying them. Still getting beat by 40. Luckily their numbers are way down and they will go down to Blue next year and do well with these sophs there. If in the Red it would be more of the same.
CYO also a self fulfilling prophecy. It's not less kids willing to play. It's less kids willing to play in an all star league of conglomerate teams and get destroyed. CYO has become the place where every kid that has a high school recruitment aspiration finds a way into the league regardless of religious or parish affiliation. The team that has won it last two years had 13 affiliated parishes, a footprint that crosses about eight school districts and zero standards as to who is eligible. They are playing two parish programs whose priest only allows Catholic kids and covers about 2 square miles. So pretty soon no one wants to play for the true CYO team and get killed by an AAU team. Then you end up with 20 AAU teams where only the best kids go to Prep, Wood and LaSalle and the rest filter back to public schools, inter ac and occasionally catholic schools. So CYO destroyed itself. In a quest to field teams they created a situation where playing field totally different and teams doing it the old way found themselves eliminated from relevance. Now the exact same nonsense happening at NG. The aforementioned CYO program that won the last two seasons had to fold mid season three years ago. Throw the standards out the window, make it about winning and getting the best kids at all cost and then bingo you go from out of business to championships. It's a total farce and a joke.
Participation will be an issue in future but that isn't the problem right now in Catholic League. Problem is top heavy league now in both divisions with the NG AAU team and the fact that no one wants to pay 10 grand to go play in a program where you can't win or compete some weeks. There are more Catholic kids playing at public schools than ever before. Throughout Delaware and Chester County kids that would have played at catholic schools are all over every districts roster. It's not changing anytime soon either.
Gang Green, I agree with your overall sentiment. Although, it may not change in the near-future, I believe it will change eventually. In general, high school football tends to be cyclical (I get the recency bias due to open boundary programs success and its sustainability). However, all it takes is for one of these programs to lose their coach (there's always talk about them jumping to college--who knows if it's true). Look at the Brooks to Infante transition, Infante wasn't great at first. A lesser coach easily could've faltered much more. Credit to SJP for a magnificent hire. Point being, in my opinion, things could change in the PCL Red if one of the great programs loses a coach or one of the middling programs hires the right one.
HS we are very very close to the point of no return here. The PCL quest for the state crown has effectively sold out the Red league outside of the big three. How do we explain Ryan getting beat by McDevitt? It is now years of watching the other red teams basically quit after back to backs of Prep/wood/LS. At this point we have to accept that the other red teams maybe wouldn't win the Blue even without NG. As a matter of fact it would be a hell of a fun league if you lumped them all together outside of the three. And it's sad when cyo reflects what we see in hs. The football trend overall is changing, and this trend we see in the red ain't changing until the big three leave, or they change.
So the solution is ...? What's not possible is to go back to the way things were 20 years ago or more. In order to survive the diocesan high schools had to get rid of the old boundaries for all students. And religious affiliation doesn't mean what it used to. When I went to SJP every kid came from a Catholic family. The one sort-of-exception was a kid who came from a Ukrainian rite family. But the Prep now takes lots of non-Catholic kids, most of whom are not athletes. I don't think the Catholic ethos has been diminished. If anything, it seems stronger.
I'm not so sure that money plays as large a role as you suggest, though I'm not so naive as to think it's unimportant. From all I understand, most kids at the Prep who play football, including most starters, pay about as much--and sometimes more--in tuition and expenses to go to the Prep as they would pay if they went to Carroll, Judge, etc. It's not as if the Prep (and I presume LaSalle too) has a million bucks to put into "football scholarships."
I don't think it's a case of the PCL eating their own so much as there aren't enough bodies out there anymore. Parents are the reason. They are keeping their boys out of it and it's finally showing in the end product. Back in the day you would have10 guys being looked at for a position. And those ten guys would spread out over the league. Now it's just 4 or 3 guys and in another 2 years it will be 2 boys. And you know where they will go.
I think several things are going on at the same time, and it would be wrong to focus on just one. I agree with Paul about the shrinking pool. Judge used to draw heavily from St. Matthew's for instance, and from what I hear it's now a trickle. And GG is right that when kids on some teams know they don't have a chance, many won't stick it out. (What's mystifying is how Roman can go from giving SJP a really good game and almost beating LaSalle last year to being entirely non-competitive against both this year.) And I suspect that kids today are less likely than kids in the past to stick with something if they're not winning or if they're not getting the attention they want or expect.
I think you also have to include a change in HS sports dynamics ... not that long ago.. most kids played 2 or 3 sports.. now they are focusing on one.. I know some schools do not like their players playing more then one sport in school (which is crazy).. but if they want to play for their school they have to make a choice
Plenty of kids playing high school football. I'm a delco guy. A lot of the public programs here have more kids playing then in 35 years and it's a direct result of Catholic football players playing at the public school as opposed to O'Hara, Bonner, Carroll, etc. A ton of programs with 100 plus kids from 9-12.
Tulla believe me I have had some level of involvement in this for 30 plus years. While it's true that the preps, lasalles,woods due to their status and success can attract players that pay full freight your head is in the sand if you don't think this is a money game. The shadow booster clubs exist everywhere for assistance. Additionally the privates can put another chair in the room and write tuition off if they like within their budget without having to pay archdiocese. But no doubt kids want to play there and will find a way to pay the tuition.
That same kid isn't paying full boat to go to Judge or Bonner. If those schools don't come up with money they go to public school. You give me 200k a year in booster money at place like Roman or Bonner and we'll get relevant quick. Way easier said then done but it's the only way from here.
I left this rat race years ago because as a coach you needed to be 10 different things other than a football coach to be successful. Recruiter, fundraiser, politician, etc and still make a living in the outside world. The wheels of this were cast years ago.
I went down a level to just coach and help younger kids and give back to my little local community. Same nonsense but even worse in ten years time. Ruined by everyone chasing the recruiting money I wanted to leave behind. Archdiocese has done a horrendous job at every level of education and extracurriculars for 25 years. What organization spends 18 months studying a situation with a panel recommends massive consolidation and turns around and reverses every decision the minute any resistance is put up. A failing one. They wont make one hard decision that might alienate any potential donor/benefactor who sees a decision as negative to their special interest.
Verdict is in. The interest in catholic education at this price point is pretty low. Definitely lower than the amount of schools they have open. Special interest alumni groups can buy certain teams etc but the genie ain't going back in the bottle. If you are Prep or LaSalle you don't play in a league anymore. You are in a league of your own. That's reality.
Tulla believe me I have had some level of involvement in this for 30 plus years. While it's true that the preps, lasalles,woods due to their status and success can attract players that pay full freight your head is in the sand if you don't think this is a money game. The shadow booster clubs exist everywhere for assistance. Additionally the privates can put another chair in the room and write tuition off if they like within their budget without having to pay archdiocese. But no doubt kids want to play there and will find a way to pay the tuition.
That same kid isn't paying full boat to go to Judge or Bonner. If those schools don't come up with money they go to public school. You give me 200k a year in booster money at place like Roman or Bonner and we'll get relevant quick. Way easier said then done but it's the only way from here.
I left this rat race years ago because as a coach you needed to be 10 different things other than a football coach to be successful. Recruiter, fundraiser, politician, etc and still make a living in the outside world. The wheels of this were cast years ago.
I went down a level to just coach and help younger kids and give back to my little local community. Same nonsense but even worse in ten years time. Ruined by everyone chasing the recruiting money I wanted to leave behind. Archdiocese has done a horrendous job at every level of education and extracurriculars for 25 years. What organization spends 18 months studying a situation with a panel recommends massive consolidation and turns around and reverses every decision the minute any resistance is put up. A failing one. They wont make one hard decision that might alienate any potential donor/benefactor who sees a decision as negative to their special interest.
Verdict is in. The interest in catholic education at this price point is pretty low. Definitely lower than the amount of schools they have open. Special interest alumni groups can buy certain teams etc but the genie ain't going back in the bottle. If you are Prep or LaSalle you don't play in a league anymore. You are in a league of your own. That's reality.
I can't pretend to know anything about Delco, but from what I hear about the area generally numbers (especially of kids who stay in a football program until they graduate) are going down. Where I live most of the year (upstate NY) numbers are way down, and many schools have dropped football. What I can pretty much guarantee is that within a few years the concerns about brain injuries will have an effect on Delco and everywhere else.
I agree with your general point about diocesan schools. The Archdiocese hasn't come to terms with the fundamental changes of recent decades.
I don't disagree that money makes a difference. My point is that the idea that's out there that the Prep is giving full rides or almost full rides to most of the starters on the football team is some distance from reality. Players who come from relatively affluent families pay quite a bit. I know how much the Prep raises from its alumni every year. If you were to believe the rumors, there is more money donated to the football program than to the general Prep fund--not even close.
While I understand football numbers are down nationwide it's relevancy to this problem is way, way down the list. It's a competitive balance issue.
Ask yourself this question. Do you think these JV cancelations happen if the opponent is Ohara as opposed to Prep and LaSalle?
What happens next year when new PIAA numbers come out and some reds become blues. It's coming. Something has to give. If they go by the old well Prep going to have to crossover with McDevitt scenario you are going to see GA-NG type cancelations. In fact you see them at freshmen and JV level right now.
There is a huge problem and there is no solution. Plus if NG wins 2a, you know full well PIAA is going to go ballistic. This is close to blowing apart at the seams.
Ask yourself this question. Do you think these JV cancelations happen if the opponent is Ohara as opposed to Prep and LaSalle?
What happens next year when new PIAA numbers come out and some reds become blues. It's coming. Something has to give. If they go by the old well Prep going to have to crossover with McDevitt scenario you are going to see GA-NG type cancelations. In fact you see them at freshmen and JV level right now.
There is a huge problem and there is no solution. Plus if NG wins 2a, you know full well PIAA is going to go ballistic. This is close to blowing apart at the seams.
Not sure if the national trends are of minimal relevance. In addition to the generally lower numbers there is also the matter of demographics. We've seen the demographics of baseball and basketball change, and I think the same can be said of football. From what I can see, this applies to all the schools in the PCL--and the Interac for that matter. The concern about brain injuries will only accelerate the demographic change. (I'm curious: has the demographic profile of kids playing high school football in Delaware County changed?)
Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought the cancelled JV games were the result mainly of low numbers--not a competitive imbalance (understanding that the imbalance is a factor contributing to the low numbers).
I think the N-G situation in the Blue Division is quite different from the Prep/LaSalle/Wood situation in the Red. Different problem requires a different solution.
I wish there were much more competitive balance in the PCL, especially the Red. And I agree with you that much of the problem has nothing to do with football but with the attractiveness (in terms of education and value for the money spent) of many of the diocesan high schools. Frankly, I can't think of anything the Prep and LaSalle can do to address that problem.
Gang....why would a "stud" ever opt to sit on the sideline if he can start at another school?....especially given the cost of college today and his likelihood (being a stud) of getting a scholarship. I'd jump at FJ, RC, AC etc for the opportunity to get noticed but especially to play.
I've seen a number of PCL freshman games this year. I was mostly impressed with Roman & Carroll. Roman had a game recently in Roxborough. They had a good number of kids, and had size, speed, and a QB who could throw accurately 50 yards. More impressive was the number of spectators enthusiastically cheering Roman on. So it could, in fact, be cyclical.
Stalker it happens all the time. For instance I am close to kid who is on the Prep team now. He went there with clear understanding of how good they would be. He had opportunity to go to more than one inter ac with significant financial assistance. He liked the prep best. Academically, socially, and football wise. He isn't good enough to play for them as senior. If he transferred tomorrow to his local public school he is a two way starter on a one loss team. It happens. The kid loves the school and that is more important to him and his family then being a starter. I applaud them. Damn few high school football players are getting a scholarship. That's part of the fantasy fueling the insanity. Even D3 need based aid ain't what it used to be.
Prep right now has a receiver who would be O'Hara's starting QB if he went there. He also would be his local public school's starting QB. He's a tenth grader. He will never play QB there. Might be a helluva receiver but will never play QB and has been moved. A lot of kids in that boat at these places. Look at LaSalle backup QB. If starter doesn't get hurt the kid likely never plays a varsity down. These places are littered with good players who run under kicks etc.
Tulla the JV issue about way more than numbers. Same with freshmen. These teams don't want to play Wood, Prep and LaSalle. it's not like they cancel their JV or freshmen seasons.
Prep right now has a receiver who would be O'Hara's starting QB if he went there. He also would be his local public school's starting QB. He's a tenth grader. He will never play QB there. Might be a helluva receiver but will never play QB and has been moved. A lot of kids in that boat at these places. Look at LaSalle backup QB. If starter doesn't get hurt the kid likely never plays a varsity down. These places are littered with good players who run under kicks etc.
Tulla the JV issue about way more than numbers. Same with freshmen. These teams don't want to play Wood, Prep and LaSalle. it's not like they cancel their JV or freshmen seasons.
GG, send me the name of the soph. WR. I want to see if it's the kid I'm thinking about. Thanks.
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Don't know why any of you are surprised. I sated on here years ago that the PCL would come to an end because of the recruiting by schools with deeper pockets. As I have said before the only to save the smaller schools is for them to join aother leagues. LC back to pioneer, CEC to bicentennial and so forth. Playing schools their on size and nearby communities. Let LS and Prep join the Inter-ac or travel the countries looking for games. Why should the majority of schools be whipping boys for the sake of national publicity. Or maybe the Archdiocese sees this as a way of eliminating the financially weak schools.
This is spot on: "agree with you that much of the problem has nothing to do with football but with the attractiveness (in terms of education and value for the money spent) of many of the diocesan high schools."
Most parents are not making school decisions with football blinders on. Unless their son is likely to get significant college football interest (which is a minority of the total # of football players, even for LaSalle, Wood and SJP), parents are making high school decisions based on the total package that the school can deliver for their sons. The academic/athletic/extracurricular/alumni networking packages that these schools (LaSalle & SJP in particular) offer are likely seen as materially stronger than those of Roman, FJ, Ryan, Carroll, O'Hara, etc. I don't know the data on college placements for all of these schools but I'd wager a lot that LaSalle/SJP have much better college placement/acceptance rates than the rest of the PCL.
Also, while likely not a culprit in the recent past and 2017 state of affairs in the PCL, CTE/brain injury awareness will ABSOLUTELY continue to grow and will continue to shrink the pool of available players, especially if real-time CTE diagnosis becomes available, which seems ever more likely.
There are two groups of people. LS/Prep people defending the way it is now, looking for any excuse of bad coaching, weak parenting etc to excuse the present state. And those who see reality. And reality ain't gonna change anytime soon.
Nobody has been tougher on the coach/coaches at Roman than the Roman supporters on here. Where have any Prep/LaSalle people (including me) blamed weak parenting?
Did I understand this right... Prep and LaSalle will end the PCL just because of better football programs? I think we are reaching here a little... So if Devon Prep comes in and kicks ass in tennis will that scare Prep and LaSalle out of the PCL. Think you are missing the big picture.
You really can't compare being a back up at St Joes or Lasalle to any other program. The back up QB at St Joes may get to travel places to play big games , win a state championship or two, then end up at an Ivy League school at be set for life. The back up QB at Bonner or Ridley gets his head beat in for 4 years ( if he chooses to stick it out ) then most likely has 40 years of work at Boeing- not that there's anything wrong with that. It's just 2 different ways of life.
Where is there any mention of "weak parenting" on this thread? The comments about parents/parenting are that they are taking their sons out of football and/or how they are making their high school decisions. How/why is that "weak" in any way? Parents who opt out of the sport most closely linked to traumatic brain injury or who are looking at non-football factors when picking a high school sound like good/thoughtful parents, not weak.
I'd also be curious to hear how you're defining "reality" here.
Shoe has been salivating at the prospect of the PCL shutting down for several years. Among the points he misses is that there are many more sports than football.
Career back-up QBs at LaSalle and SJP have ZERO chance of playing for an Ivy school. More broadly, the back-ups in all positions have little-to-zero chance of playing in college. Your point about college and post-college is exactly what I said earlier - parents are making HS decisions based on the total package a school offers, not solely on the success of its football program.
SoCal: I think we are saying the same thing. I'm not saying the back up QB at St Joes will play at an Ivy school. But he has a much better chance of getting in as a student. And if he gets in he's set for life.
Speed plenty of Prep kids at workman like jobs as well. If a kid is an Ivy League student (not talking legacy) they can do it just about anywhere.
Have seven close friends who are ivy grads. Two from Bonner, two from O'Hara, one from Upper Darby, one from Prep, one from Ridley. All football guys. Harvard,Cornell, Penn guys.
Two of my buddies are prep guys who are daytime bartenders. Business partners with another Prep guy. Know tons of prep guys.
The fallacy of go to private school and set for life is just that fallacy. Is that sold and do people pay money for that theory, you bet. Paying 20 grand for high school is a choice and can be a very good one. To think your 20 grand gets you anymore than a good hs education is a stretch at best, fantasy at worst. That drives people who spend or spent the money crazy but if you want to be a student and successful you can do that at many places.
Plenty of Prep guys at kutztown and Penn St. Best prep guy I've ever know was a steam fitter. Best way to be set for life is make your money the old fashioned American way. Inherit it.
Have seven close friends who are ivy grads. Two from Bonner, two from O'Hara, one from Upper Darby, one from Prep, one from Ridley. All football guys. Harvard,Cornell, Penn guys.
Two of my buddies are prep guys who are daytime bartenders. Business partners with another Prep guy. Know tons of prep guys.
The fallacy of go to private school and set for life is just that fallacy. Is that sold and do people pay money for that theory, you bet. Paying 20 grand for high school is a choice and can be a very good one. To think your 20 grand gets you anymore than a good hs education is a stretch at best, fantasy at worst. That drives people who spend or spent the money crazy but if you want to be a student and successful you can do that at many places.
Plenty of Prep guys at kutztown and Penn St. Best prep guy I've ever know was a steam fitter. Best way to be set for life is make your money the old fashioned American way. Inherit it.
GG. I agree. My point was if a family thought their son was getting a superior education at Prep , Lasalle , etc , and that would help them get into a top notch college, they would be more likely to stay , even with little or no playing time.
Speed agree and totally the situation I mentioned above. Kid loves the school and program and it's about the education.
Some of the most successful guys I ever coached never started but stuck with it. It's a tremendous life lesson that not every situation works out exactly as you want or planned.
Some of the most successful guys I ever coached never started but stuck with it. It's a tremendous life lesson that not every situation works out exactly as you want or planned.
GG,
I can go you one better: I know Prep guys who wound up in jail!!! If you think about it, you might be able to do the same.
And I can give you myself as an example of someone who in a sense was disadvantaged by going to the Prep . I didn't get into Penn for an undergraduate program because that year there were so many applicants from the Prep with good academic records and SAT results that they had a high cut off point for Prep kids. So in terms of Penn I would have been in better shape if I were a Bonner student. Strangely enough, I was accepted into MD and PhD programs at Penn after my undergraduate years. Go figure.
But anecdotes are anecdotes, with all their limitations. You'd have to look at stats over many years that tell you what percentage of graduates start and finish college, what percentage get into their college of choice, what kind of careers graduates have, etc. to get a clear sense of how well a high school prepares students for life after high school. And there are other less easy to measure things to consider: to what extent a school helps get students through the perils of adolescence, whether students keep contact with the friends they made in high school and how supportive those friendships are, how equipped graduates are to adapt to new environments, etc.
Of course, the Prep is not the best school for everyone. But you make it seem as the Prep is engaged in a kind of deception--charging relatively high tuition for something that's not much different from what a host of other schools offer. They must do a good job of brainwashing because most graduates, including me, are very glad they went to the Prep.
ps. I didn't grow up in a family with a lot of money.
pps. I realize now, a couple of hours after I wrote all of the above, I went a bit over the top in my response. I understand your point of view and share many of your concerns with the way of the world in the PCL today. And I don't want to oversimplify matters related to the quality and character of different schools. Some Prep people can be obnoxious, but most aren't.
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Tulla if it came off that way that wasn't the intention. All you need to know about Prep experience is that 95 percent of people who attended swear by the place.
They have done a good job there. What I do hear from people around town is that they think their 20 grand is giving their kid some golden path with talk of connections etc like there is some secret Prep society that ensures every graduate becomes Thurston Howell III.
We all know that's not true but it's a big part of the sizzle in my woods. You are paying for a high school education that you think gives your kid the best education possible. That works for me. If your kid is a state school kid going to Prep isn't getting him to Princeton. It's about the individual and what they put into it. A lot of today's parents are delusional about their kids athletic, academic, and career potential. Prep does a great job at highlighting what they offer and providing a product people swear by if they attended.
I have friends whose kids graduated and few years later there is some slight bemoaning that the "investment" didn't get the "payoff" in the college mom or dad thought or the immediate career success they thought the 80 grand for high school was supposed to provide.
My response always is did insert name here have a good experience and get a good education. Answer pretty much universally yes. Well that's what you paid for. There is high school on earth that guarantees some great financial success. Education the foundation we want to provide as a parent. From there all the factors of the world get involved.
They have done a good job there. What I do hear from people around town is that they think their 20 grand is giving their kid some golden path with talk of connections etc like there is some secret Prep society that ensures every graduate becomes Thurston Howell III.
We all know that's not true but it's a big part of the sizzle in my woods. You are paying for a high school education that you think gives your kid the best education possible. That works for me. If your kid is a state school kid going to Prep isn't getting him to Princeton. It's about the individual and what they put into it. A lot of today's parents are delusional about their kids athletic, academic, and career potential. Prep does a great job at highlighting what they offer and providing a product people swear by if they attended.
I have friends whose kids graduated and few years later there is some slight bemoaning that the "investment" didn't get the "payoff" in the college mom or dad thought or the immediate career success they thought the 80 grand for high school was supposed to provide.
My response always is did insert name here have a good experience and get a good education. Answer pretty much universally yes. Well that's what you paid for. There is high school on earth that guarantees some great financial success. Education the foundation we want to provide as a parent. From there all the factors of the world get involved.
GG, My edited post--just something at the bottom--and your post above crossed in cyberspace. I think we basically agree.
Thanks Gang. I guess that makes it a win-loss issue in some instances. Big, big decisions for sure.
