how good was Neshaminy in the early 2000's?

[BradlyPitt]

they won the state in 2001, beating highly favored Woodland Hills in the muddiest game ever

was that a great team or did they just get lucky with the mud and Breaston getting hurt? both teams had to play in the same conditions

in 2004 they lost the state final to Central Catholic, a team many consider to be among the best in state history, was that a great Neshaminy team that just had bad luck running into an all time powerhouse, or were they a weak finalist?

 

[CAMoleskinner]

Those early 2000s were the heart of the Mark Schmidt years at Neshaminy - he had turned them around after some less than stellar years in the early '90s.

They were undefeated in 2001 and locally were known as the "Cardiac Kids" as they had been behind at the half (or behind in the game) something like 9 times. Still, they pulled them all out.

As to the Title game it was rainy and muddy and both squads played in the same quagmire. Losing Breaston hurt, no doubt, but you'd probably have to say that the 'Skins were the better "mudder" as they were a rather raucous and "blue collar" crew that excelled in the much and being the "dog". If he wasn't hurt and it was a nice dry field -- well, coulda, woulda, shoulda.

As to 2004 they really walked into a haymaker when they lined up against PCC -- period. That was a stud group from Pittsburgh and despite their 13-1 record (the one loss was to North Penn, 31-30, in the regular season) it really was a tale of two cities.

Interesting was that the 2004 group was really a bunch of underclassmen and the "brains" were figuring 2005 would be their year. And it appeared to be as they finished that regular season at 9-1 with only a 28-14 opening game loss to St. Joe's Prep marring their record. They then crushed PW and lined up against D-Town East and Pat Devlin in Langhorne. Everyone was holding their breath as if they had a weakness it was pass defense. But with six minutes to go Neshaminy was in front with a 38-28 lead. Not enough, though, as Devlin personally ran and/or threw for scores that saw the final go the the Cougars 45-38 (a bruising game it was Pennsbury -- as I recall -- that then took D-Town out the following week as East was beat up from the Neshaminy game).

Devlin was a beast and personally carried his team to the win over Langhorne.

Sounds like sour grapes but when Harrisburg lost McCoy to a broken ankle it looked to be all Neshaminy's for the taking (4A). And that was probably accurate as no team could run on Neshaminy and the only group in their way that could exploit their weakness (the air attack) was Devlin and company (of course, East then lost to Pennsbury and Pennsbury then lost to Liberty and Liberty then lost to McKeesport -- all pretty much running teams -- and keep in mind that Neshaminy clubbed Pennsbury in the regular season and the Falcons got by East in a slugfest and then Liberty got by Pennsbury in a slugfest so that Bethlehem was just gassed when they hit McKeesport).

From 2000 through 2009 Neshaminy was 93-29 under Schmidt which was not bad. His overall at Neshaminy is 161-66 and he is considered one of their best honchos among some greats including Harry Franks from the 1950s who was 69-10-2 and then John Petercuskie - who was 59-1-5 while head coach - along with Jack Swartz at 43-11-1 and then Dick Bedesem (Bishop Egan and Villanova) and John Chaump (George's brother) who are just some of the men who have guided the 'Skins.

They were pretty good in the 2000s.

 

[BradlyPitt]

was 2001 team better than 2004 or 2005?

 

[CAMoleskinner]

Well, 2001 had Jamar Brittingham (2500 yards and 30 TDs or something) who looked like D1 at a big school all day long till some academic issues popped up (he ended up at Bloomsburg where he broke every record a running back could and then was drafted by Atlanta - he got pretty far with them but honestly was a step slow for the "bigs"). They also had a pretty solid supporting cast including a young (9th grade) Kevin Kelly who ended up as one of Neshaminy's greatest kickers (and that inludes the Bahr brothers) who ended up at Penn State where I think he still has the all time scoring records in the Big Ten. etc.

In 2004 they had Georg Coleman (Temple) who ran all over everyone plus a sophomore phenom at QB in Andrew Flogel and junior Tom McKeuon (sp) who went on to letter at Penn State (and Kelly who was a senior that year hit everything he kicked).

In 2005 they were carrying heavy again (and I am not naming all their kids who played at various levels for 2001, 2004 and 2005) - I'm forgetting names right now.

At 38-4 for those three years it's hard to say which team was "tops". I loved 2001 as they were punchers. The 2004 squad was a bunch of youngsters playing up and 2005 was a team that probably should have brought it all home save for Devlin!

Call it a three way toss up (just shows how hard it is making it all the way or winning it all).

 

[Fletchster1]

One small update, Skinner. After beating the Skins, Dtown East traveled to Crawford to play North Penn (not Pennsbury). Different weather conditions than the mild conditions a week prior at Heartbreak Ridge, so East wasn't able to get the passing game going against NP. NP won and ended up winning District 1. Some say that the NP game was the catalyst for East switching from spread to a power running game.

I would rank those 3 Skins' teams as follows: 2005, 2001, 2004.

 

[CAMoleskinner]

Fletch --

You are correct (as always)!!

I was banging out a lot of info quickly last night -- off the top of my head -- and with my aging and shrinking brain I'm afraid I need to check the reference materials a bit more than in the past (before I write -- gees, my Dad was correct about the memory beginning to fade).

The point here is that when you looked over the landscape it really seemed as if 2005 was Neshaminy's year with the one "challenge" being Devlin and his arm as that could exploit the weakness. If you looked at the run Neshaminy would have had to McKeesport the 'Skins matched up perfectly with all of them (Langhorne beat NP 41-13 in the regular season -- I looked that one up).

 

[CAMoleskinner]

PS I like your analysis on the teams except I might say that 2005 and 2001 might tie for first as that earlier crew did bring a trophy home.

 

[Fletchster1]

No doubt, both the 2001 and 2005 teams were really good. It was the lights-out method of victory that the 2005 team had week in and week out that sets them apart from the 2001 State Title Squad. The 2005 team thoroughly destroyed every PIAA team they played until Devlin and the boys stunned them on that Friday night in November 2005.

 

[Stalker]

PS I like your analysis on the teams except I might say that 2005 and 2001 might tie for first as that earlier crew did bring a trophy home.

Fletch-Skinner Man;
Using Power Rating I've toyed with have it this way; 2005, 2004, 2001, strictly working from a statistical base. But if you compare more recent teams it looks like this; 2013, 2008, 2005, 2007, 2004, 2001.
Better and best are shaky terms. But there's no denying the 'golden' mud bowl win in 2001. In our case (the D3 horde) it was the Mud-Blood and the Beer bowl. Absolutely miserable game I was certain Woody would win. But Skins had well under rated guys at receiver and a really solid Qb apart from that back! Hard factoring Breaston in any more than you do a fumble or missed tackle with injuries a part of the game.

 

[CAMoleskinner]

Stalk -

As always - you dig in and get your number-crunching machine going and then add the icing to the cake.

I was gonna mention in my posts -- and at the minimum -- 2013 but the question was centered on the early 2000s.

Then adding to the above, and if it was a bit more open-ended (the thread), I would have put 2013 at the front of the pack too. At 13-2 that was the team that we'll always look at and say "coulda, woulda, shoulda". A rock-crushing group I recall that in the fourth game they gave up a TD (the first points of the season) and everyone went nuts as the "plan" was to "goose egg" everyone (it was 45-0 and Schmidt put in the 9th grade team in the third-quarter so that the final was 45-7).

That team set the record at Neshaminy for total points (531) and featured the 4A Player of the Year in D'Andre Pollard (he finished just shy of 3,000 yards with 2,929 and 39 TDs). Luke Carrezola was also a USA Today all PA performer (he, Pollard and Denny Lord - the FB - were all 1st team All State) with Carrezola starring at UConn and then getting a look by a few NFL teams before playing with the Salt Lake club in one of those short lived pro leagues of the late teens - Pollard went to Temple but was dogged by injury as was Lord at West Chester).

Of course, the short circuit in 2013 was the Eastern Final against St. Joe's which they lost 37-21. Curiously, they had no passing game and relied on the brute running of Lord and his compatriot FB, Blake Sullivan (each 6-1 and then 224 and 242 respectively) in addition to Pollard. And run they could as they were trouncing The Prep on the ground. But still behind to start the the second half (they were down 19-13) they took the kickoff and were in the redzone on another 80 yard, 5 yard a run drive when Lord was breaking free. With a habit of holding the ball like a loaf of bread all season long St. Joe's certainly had noticed and this time a "strip" worked. The loose ball was then picked up and returned 90 yards by a St. Joe's player for a score to make it 26-13. Neshaminy just couldn't do enough after that as it was really a back breaker (Lord did score for Neshaminy on a long run to redeem himself -- and as he was a gamer so you couldn't blame his efforts all year long at FB and linebacker).

Of course, St. Joe's crushed a solid but not spectacular PCC in the final, 35-10, and observers of the day felt Neshaminy would have produced a similar result.

THAT was the year that really got away from the 'Skins.

Those other seasons were certainly good (an 11-2 2007 team and 12-2 2008 group) with both of them having shots. Still, I know you'll recall they walked into a face punch down in your neck of the woods when Ridley ended their 2007 run in the playoffs and then it was North Penn in the D1 final that got them in 2008.

I thought both those later 2000 teams had great potential but sorta underperformed in the playoffs in their losses. But the 2013 team - now that was a group. In fact, they had so many players people were talking about them in 2008 and 2009 when the kids were in junior high - we all just couldn't wait (ugh, "The Fumble" -- as they call it - cost Schmidt another trophy). Course, they had all the pieces save for one thing - a QB. As it was, they actually used Lord in the shotgun and just gave him the ball and said "run". He threw a few passes too (quite a good athlete). Plus Pollard - he was elusive, fast, shifty, quick -- everything you'd want.

Anyway, if you took those six years -- 2001, 2004, 2005, 2007, 2008 and 2013 -- you see an overall of 74-10 and they certainly represent perhaps the best years of the Schmidt era which ran from 1995 to 2013.

 

[Fletchster1]

Prep had the speed, but the Skins were mauling them on the ground. Pollard and Lord were running through some monster holes and there was definitely some panic from the SJP faithful. That strip (occurred at 4 yard line) was a huge play by SJP that I believe altered the outcome of the game. Skins score there, I feel the SJP kids were worn out.

Prep did not want to tackle Lord, not many people did. Lord ended up at Kutztown and Pollard at Nova.

 

[CAMoleskinner]

Fletch -

Being younger than I am I know you have a keener recall on some of the "finer" details (like the fact that Pollard went to Villanova - not Temple - and Lord went to Kutztown and not West Chester -- I think I need to pull up the site more when I'm writing these responses).

Yikes - (I do like having some backup help, though).

That strip/fumble still haunts me. If there were a game changing event or play that was it (dang it). And that video from the game that shows Schmidt on the sidelines -- as he bent over and put his hands on his knees as the St. Joe's player raced by him on the run to the endzone -- just says it all.

 

[Stalker]

Here's a bit more on the 6 teams mentioned above.

Rank and Order (PRs)

2013 439.16 (13-2)
Lost to Pennsbury 31-3 (10-2) and St. Joseph's Prep 37-21 (12-3)
2008 438.88 (12-2)
Lost to Souderton 14-13 (5-6) and North Penn 28-0 (14-1)
2005 438.47 (10-2)
Lost to St. Joseph's Prep 28-14 (11-2) and Downingtown East 45-38 (11-2)
2007 435.00 (11-2)
Lost Central Bucks South 26-21 (11-1) and Ridley 27-7 (13-1)
2004 429.35 (13-2)
Lost to North Penn 31-30 (10-3) and Central Catholic 49-14 (16-0)
2001 428.67 (15-0)
N/A

Won-loss of teams Skins lost to 113-20. A winning percentage of 84.96.

Point of this is to show the opponents lost to....and their records reflecting high quality losses except Souderton in 2008. Remember that period where they bottomed up against weak teams leaving you scratching your head?

 

[newport]

That final score is a little misleading. It never felt like Neshaminy was really out of the game because of what they could do on the ground. This was a GREAT high school football game. I remember being there. And that goal line strip/run back was one of the greatest momentum shifts I have ever seen

 

[CAMoleskinner]

After the smackdown last night (Bucks 22 - 'Skins 0) I found myself leafing through the archives a bit longer than planned. And while I was I couldn't help but consider 2010 Langhorne which finished 12-2 as also deserving a nod with those other six "up the food chain" clubs Coach Schmidt produced from 2001 to 2013 (just a little over one every other year).

 

[D1 Transplant]

Skinner,
To me, a bad year at Neshaminy is 7 and 3. They are struggling again this season, so here is my question to you, and any one else. Do you have enough of a sample size to believe a coaching change is in order?

 

[CAMoleskinner]

D1 -

Neshaminy's current head honcho, Steve Wilmot, is a local guy who went to Springfield MontCo. He then played ball at Lock Haven under Mark Schmidt (he was a stud lineman there) and after graduating he followed Coach Schmidt to Neshaminy (in 1995). He served as an assistant coach right through to 2013 - Schmidt's last year - and then took the 2014 campaign off. He returned as the new head coach in 2015.

From 2015 through 2018 Wilmot's clubs were 38-11 (about an 80% winning percentage) with 2016 seeing an 11-1 effort and 2017 producing a 10-2 scorecard (2015 was 9-4 and 2018 came in at 8-4). His playoff record those years is 5-4.

In 2019 the 'Skins were 5-5 and then the Covid years saw a 5-1 and then 2-8 result. Adding in this season's 4-3 record so far sees them at 16-17 for that run over the last 4 years (not what you'd want to see and with only the oddball Covid year of 2020 at 5-1 being "OK").

Anyway, I think it's a little early to throw the baby out with the bath water as, to be honest, it would seem the talent has been a little down starting in 2019. I'm not close enough to know everything about the pipeline but I probably would have heard if it was "real good" or "real bad" so the horizon looks the same (for what that is worth).

Considering myself representative of the typical diehard Redskin fan I think we have a tendency to remain loyal beyond the time others might be hanging the coach in effigy (I did see that in 1966 when Tom McHugh followed the great John Petercuskie and even then it seemed a little extreme for high school ball -- McHugh went 2-6-2 that year right behind Petercuskie's 59-1-5 overall and that was McHugh's last year in Langhorne).

I also have heard that when Coach Wilmot's boy (a freshman on the team) heads to college he may hang it up to make more time for him. And that would be 30 years or so for Wilmot and it would make sense (so I don't think we'll see any war parties during the next three years).

Still, not a person I know including me -- and Coach Wilmot too as I do know him a bit -- isn't slowly twisting over the last few seasons (plus last night's game was really rather pathetic and that is not taking anything away from CBW as they have a solid bunch this year, no doubt).

Go 'Skins!!

 

[Stalker]

D1 -

Neshaminy's current head honcho, Steve Wilmot, is a local guy who went to Springfield MontCo. He then played ball at Lock Haven under Mark Schmidt (he was a stud lineman there) and after graduating he followed Coach Schmidt to Neshaminy (in 1995). He served as an assistant coach right through to 2013 - Schmidt's last year - and then took the 2014 campaign off. He returned as the new head coach in 2015.

From 2015 through 2018 Wilmot's clubs were 38-11 (about an 80% winning percentage) with 2016 seeing an 11-1 effort and 2017 producing a 10-2 scorecard (2015 was 9-4 and 2018 came in at 8-4). His playoff record those years is 5-4.

In 2019 the 'Skins were 5-5 and then the Covid years saw a 5-1 and then 2-8 result. Adding in this season's 4-3 record so far sees them at 16-17 for that run over the last 4 years (not what you'd want to see and with only the oddball Covid year of 2020 at 5-1 being "OK").

Anyway, I think it's a little early to throw the baby out with the bath water as, to be honest, it would seem the talent has been a little down starting in 2019. I'm not close enough to know everything about the pipeline but I probably would have heard if it was "real good" or "real bad" so the horizon looks the same (for what that is worth).

Considering myself representative of the typical diehard Redskin fan I think we have a tendency to remain loyal beyond the time others might be hanging the coach in effigy (I did see that in 1966 when Tom McHugh followed the great John Petercuskie and even then it seemed a little extreme for high school ball -- McHugh went 2-6-2 that year right behind Petercuskie's 59-1-5 overall and that was McHugh's last year in Langhorne).

I also have heard that when Coach Wilmot's boy (a freshman on the team) heads to college he may hang it up to make more time for him. And that would be 30 years or so for Wilmot and it would make sense (so I don't think we'll see any war parties during the next three years).

Still, not a person I know including me -- and Coach Wilmot too as I do know him a bit -- isn't slowly twisting over the last few seasons (plus last night's game was really rather pathetic and that is not taking anything away from CBW as they have a solid bunch this year, no doubt).

Go 'Skins!!

Skinner Man. What's with 6 of 7 games to date being away games? 6 of 7!!!! No one bitched about this, sought a redress?

 

[CAMoleskinner]

Stalk -

I believe it had something to do with the fact they are going to turf the field. Apparently there were some plans to begin during the season and then it was pushed back and that's what screwed everything up. As it is, the practice field and baseball field are well underway. They actually lined the area in front of the school with a football field and that is where they have been practicing (it's a pretty big section to the right of the tree lined driveway that dominates that part of the campus -- it's many, many acres, the campus, and is quite large).