AAA game
- Thread starter 00shoe
- Start date
Who the hell told you that? I didn't think the score would be that bad, but nobody in their right mind expected this to be within four touchdowns.
It's safe to say D12 has made a mockery of 3A in the east. These are not preliminary games, these are the state quarter and semi finals. The east used to have very good teams (Berwick, Strath Haven, ACC and Manheim Central to name a few). What happened?
Scores from the past 5 years leading into Hershey:
2011
Wood 41 Pottsgrove 22
Wood 70 ACC 14
2012
Wood 35 Interboro 7
Wood 36 ACC 6
2013
Wood 42 Academy Park 14
Wood 42 Berwick 14
2014
Wood 44 Great Valley 7
Wood 63 Somerset 20
2015
Imhotep 46 Academy Park 16
Imhotep 72 Saucon Valley 27
Scores from the past 5 years leading into Hershey:
2011
Wood 41 Pottsgrove 22
Wood 70 ACC 14
2012
Wood 35 Interboro 7
Wood 36 ACC 6
2013
Wood 42 Academy Park 14
Wood 42 Berwick 14
2014
Wood 44 Great Valley 7
Wood 63 Somerset 20
2015
Imhotep 46 Academy Park 16
Imhotep 72 Saucon Valley 27
This score doesn't surprise me at all. Tep is very impressive and I don't think anyone will beat them. Great info Relayer, it puts it all in perspective. Open enrollment has it's advantages.
I can remember when Haven played Wyoming Area at Coatesville in 2003. The WA guys on the board (much respect) thought it was their year. Haven won that game 49-0. They came on the board and said, Wow we're we wrong. We're not in the same league. This game kind of reminds me of that in Philly area team dominating an up state team.
As far as speed, you can neutralize it in two ways. If you have outside LB's with quick speed that can cover the outsides coupled with a defensive line control, your not going anywhere.
I can remember when Haven played Wyoming Area at Coatesville in 2003. The WA guys on the board (much respect) thought it was their year. Haven won that game 49-0. They came on the board and said, Wow we're we wrong. We're not in the same league. This game kind of reminds me of that in Philly area team dominating an up state team.
As far as speed, you can neutralize it in two ways. If you have outside LB's with quick speed that can cover the outsides coupled with a defensive line control, your not going anywhere.
We saw this coming at the beginning of the year. The addition of 2 very good coaches to their staff ,coupled with several d-1 players ,and at least 5 players that I recognize as being former athletes on 4 different PCL teams that now belong to the Tep. Albie has done a remarkable job assembling a powerhouse program.
Big question Relayer,...what happened? Guess the best analogy would be the "Perfect Storm", a gathering of conditions and influences that have damaged HS FB leading off with open enrollment. You hear cyclical all the time. Open enrollment isn't cyclical.
Coaches come and go, talent ebbs and flows but other larger issues are influencing like demography and interest itself in the sport for a number of reasons particularly soccer and concussion issues.
There are still good AAA teams but the standard has changed, creating a paradigm shift, leaving us thinking Academy Park, Saucon Valley, etc aren't strong teams. They are! Somerset had one of their "best evers" last year. The values have changed.
Since Erie Cathedral Prep dropped to 3A in 2009 and Bishop McDevitt joined them in 2010, it's not like the west has posed them much of a challenge either. They're a combined 22-4 against everybody else from the round of 16 on. McDevitt has never lost a D3 playoff game in 3A.
2015
Bishop McDevitt over Solanco 35-7
Bishop McDevitt over Susquehanna Township 33-19
Erie Cathedral Prep over Conneaut 43-21
Erie Cathedral Prep over Thomas Jefferson 26-21
2014
Bishop McDevitt over Red Land 44-0
Bishop McDevitt over Cocalico 41-0
Conneaut over Erie Cathedral Prep 14-0
Central Valley over Bishop McDevitt 26-21
2013
Bishop McDevitt over Conrad Weiser 49-21
Bishop McDevitt over Manheim Central 48-7
Erie Cathedral Prep over General McLane 63-21
Erie Cathedral Prep over West Allegheny 28-0
2012
Bishop McDevitt over Lancaster Catholic 27-7
Bishop McDevitt over West York 21-10
Erie Cathedral Prep over General McLane 48-14
Erie Cathedral Prep over West Allegheny 27-13
2011
Bishop McDevitt over Red Land 42-7
Bishop McDevitt over Lampeter Strasburg 28-14
Bishop McDevitt over Montour 41-32
Grove City over Erie Cathedral Prep 33-0
2010
Erie Cathedral Prep over Grove City 28-16
Erie Cathedral Prep over Central Valley 31-21
Bishop McDevitt over Lampeter Strasburg 40-10
Bishop McDevitt over Cocalico 29-14
2009
Erie Cathedral Prep over Schenley 44-12
West Allegheny over Erie Cathedral Prep 36-21
The scores aren't as ridiculous as the D12 scores, but I have a pretty good idea that these two teams are going to be playing this weekend.
And what'll be interesting is, I think the new classifications split all of these teams up. What's going to happen is there will be "captive classes" (Ohio's had the same problem since going 8 classes) and rather than these teams knocking each other out, they're going to be rolling through 3A through 5A by themselves.
2015
Bishop McDevitt over Solanco 35-7
Bishop McDevitt over Susquehanna Township 33-19
Erie Cathedral Prep over Conneaut 43-21
Erie Cathedral Prep over Thomas Jefferson 26-21
2014
Bishop McDevitt over Red Land 44-0
Bishop McDevitt over Cocalico 41-0
Conneaut over Erie Cathedral Prep 14-0
Central Valley over Bishop McDevitt 26-21
2013
Bishop McDevitt over Conrad Weiser 49-21
Bishop McDevitt over Manheim Central 48-7
Erie Cathedral Prep over General McLane 63-21
Erie Cathedral Prep over West Allegheny 28-0
2012
Bishop McDevitt over Lancaster Catholic 27-7
Bishop McDevitt over West York 21-10
Erie Cathedral Prep over General McLane 48-14
Erie Cathedral Prep over West Allegheny 27-13
2011
Bishop McDevitt over Red Land 42-7
Bishop McDevitt over Lampeter Strasburg 28-14
Bishop McDevitt over Montour 41-32
Grove City over Erie Cathedral Prep 33-0
2010
Erie Cathedral Prep over Grove City 28-16
Erie Cathedral Prep over Central Valley 31-21
Bishop McDevitt over Lampeter Strasburg 40-10
Bishop McDevitt over Cocalico 29-14
2009
Erie Cathedral Prep over Schenley 44-12
West Allegheny over Erie Cathedral Prep 36-21
The scores aren't as ridiculous as the D12 scores, but I have a pretty good idea that these two teams are going to be playing this weekend.
And what'll be interesting is, I think the new classifications split all of these teams up. What's going to happen is there will be "captive classes" (Ohio's had the same problem since going 8 classes) and rather than these teams knocking each other out, they're going to be rolling through 3A through 5A by themselves.
What you do is combine recruits/ transfers from several schools with coaching transfers that are disgruntled that they can't win championships at their former school and poof you have a powerhouse state champion. Schmidt and Gordon should be embarrassed to win this way, how hard is it to Coach that talent.
I'm sure District 2 Holy Redeemer and District 2 Holy Cross are excited for that to happen.
Point well taken. I guess I should have clarified my position better. I wouldn't expect a team like Holy Cross move up to 6A considering they would only be an A team next year. I would move them up to 3A.
Most of the guys on this board are 4A. Most 4A competitive public schools can like North Penn, Pennsbury, etc. can hang with LaSalle. The problem I see which many don't look at is the 3A and 2A cath. team who are too competitive for the 3A and 2A public schools. They just don't have the numbers on their side. If you look at all the good Haven teams through the years, their lines were never as big as what Wood has. Haven's 2010 team (lost to Wood 24-14) had a nice line but couldn't control Wood on either side of the ball.
I'm waiting for the day when a team decides to forfeit a playoff game against a cath school. I know the PIAA has taken some heat on how they've handed the cath schools joining.
Personally, I have nothing against any private school (great education). I think there should be some adjustments to offset the powers. I can see how HR and HC could be at a disadvantage. I'm assuming demographics play a part? not enough kids in the area to draw from?
Most of the guys on this board are 4A. Most 4A competitive public schools can like North Penn, Pennsbury, etc. can hang with LaSalle. The problem I see which many don't look at is the 3A and 2A cath. team who are too competitive for the 3A and 2A public schools. They just don't have the numbers on their side. If you look at all the good Haven teams through the years, their lines were never as big as what Wood has. Haven's 2010 team (lost to Wood 24-14) had a nice line but couldn't control Wood on either side of the ball.
I'm waiting for the day when a team decides to forfeit a playoff game against a cath school. I know the PIAA has taken some heat on how they've handed the cath schools joining.
Personally, I have nothing against any private school (great education). I think there should be some adjustments to offset the powers. I can see how HR and HC could be at a disadvantage. I'm assuming demographics play a part? not enough kids in the area to draw from?
What the hell. What can I say.
Sorry for being so wordy and ll over the place. My wife kept interrupting my train of thought with her cookie making, "help me with this and that" BS.....
If we look at what TEP just did to SV at the 3A level, something should be done.
Palisades did that against Bethlehem Catholic in the D11 duals wrestling tournament a couple years ago when Becahi was in 2A. But rather than forfeit the match as a whole, they just didn't ever send any kids out, meaning Becahi individually sent 14 kids out to accept the forfeits for each match, making kind of a scene. It was part protest (which you could say worked, because Becahi moved up to 3A last year) and part strategy, as there are two state tournament berths with a "true second", so by forfeiting what was a guaranteed loss to Becahi, they could keep everybody fresh for the consolation brackets.
But no coach is ever going to do that again, because the Palisades head coach was suspended for the rest of the season and individual post season, then fired at the end of the year. District 11 suspended him for all of the next season and put him on probation for the next three seasons due to a violation of the sportsmanship rules. They also ruled any school that hired him in D11 would be barred from postseason competition. When he appealed that to the PIAA, the state upheld the suspension and determined that any team in the state who hired him to coach would be barred from participating in the postseason. He sued the PIAA, and ended up with a settlement that he could accept a volunteer assistant position, but could not be a head coach. The forfeit move submarined his entire career, and I doubt he's ever going to be a head coach again, though all of his kids wearing "Free Omar" shirts at individual districts was awesome.
So I sincerely doubt a coach will forfeit a state playoff game to a Catholic school, because that will be the end of their career, because state playoff football is a little higher profile than 2A wrestling, so I think the backlash and punishment would be even greater.
Unbelieveable Rover. Harsh for making an important statement. I know there's WPIAL coaches who have complained about the cath schools playing. I believe Mike White from Pitt Post G has written a story on it. Though for D7 schools, their Championships at Heinz field is their ultimate final. The subject of starting up a EPIAL was brought up on this board years ago. Wouldn't that shake up the PIAA.
The PIAA can't handle student transfers. What makes you think they'll be able to handle Private schools?
Student transfer disputes are only kicked off by the sending school having a hissy fit. Then the kid loses a whole season. A harsh and uneven system where the adult gets of scott free and the kid is buried. The PIAA should allow all transfers...with all transfers losing 4 games of the season.
So, if it can't be all catholic or privates how does one decide? What's the deciding data point? That's the question. What are the offsets?
Pt:you either move the schools up in classifications or put them in their own.
As far as transfers, I don't think it's about not being able to handle them, they try to avoid the legal battles. I don't think PIAA will allow "all transfers" because their rules state not for athletic reasons. The public schools have to make a stand and confront the PIAA on these issues. You and I know that's not going to happen. I know at Haven their priority is education. Kids sit out if their grades aren't good. So sports, though important in the community, the school district tolerates it.
The right people in the right positions need to make the correct decisions!
As far as transfers, I don't think it's about not being able to handle them, they try to avoid the legal battles. I don't think PIAA will allow "all transfers" because their rules state not for athletic reasons. The public schools have to make a stand and confront the PIAA on these issues. You and I know that's not going to happen. I know at Haven their priority is education. Kids sit out if their grades aren't good. So sports, though important in the community, the school district tolerates it.
The right people in the right positions need to make the correct decisions!
Saw in paper today that Derrick Henry of Alabama wanted to transfer a year or two ago. Jumbled backfield, low on depth chart. Family convinced him to stay and work hard. How about that, didn't take path of least resistance and won the Heisman!
Different sport, but I know. Big Ten wrestling coach who removes kids from his recruiting board who transfer during high school. Now, he's at a school where he's only recruits blue chippers, so he has the luxury of being very selective. But after he had some team and character problems early in his career, he decided that was a red flag he could weed out.
He explained the logic to me that if a kid can pick up and leave his friends and teammates who he's been with his whole life to find greener grass, what makes him think they'll buy in to his college program and team.
Obviously that's not everywhere, or even most places. I've always thought it was an interesting perspective.
He explained the logic to me that if a kid can pick up and leave his friends and teammates who he's been with his whole life to find greener grass, what makes him think they'll buy in to his college program and team.
Obviously that's not everywhere, or even most places. I've always thought it was an interesting perspective.
Not to change the subject, but......
It looks as if Marlon Worthy won, Rover. The moronic School Board is forming that Committee to get rid of Steve.
EPC, I'll bump the other thread to keep this thread on topic after this post. I haven't seen local news today, did something happen beyond the school board meeting the other night where they announced the committee?
As I said before, I don't even have a problem with administrator privately addressing with Steve perceived problems with the program, and I do think you need a succession plan for a 64 year old head coach who has already retired from teaching (ditto for the wrestling program). But to publicly announce a committee to address Steve's performance and allot an agenda item at a school board meeting to a public airing of grievances, with the essential complaint being his offense and play calling is preventing a state championship, is a total failure of leadership in the athletic department and does nothing but publicly embarrass the winningest coach in school history who has been on the staff since 1975, and the head coach for 23 years in a job that gets probably five times the scrutiny as mayor of Easton.
And if what this group truly wants is a home run hire to replace Shiffert, can you even imagine being Tim Moncman looking at the Easton job, seeing how this all is being handled, and think "gee, I'd love to work there?"
As I said before, I don't even have a problem with administrator privately addressing with Steve perceived problems with the program, and I do think you need a succession plan for a 64 year old head coach who has already retired from teaching (ditto for the wrestling program). But to publicly announce a committee to address Steve's performance and allot an agenda item at a school board meeting to a public airing of grievances, with the essential complaint being his offense and play calling is preventing a state championship, is a total failure of leadership in the athletic department and does nothing but publicly embarrass the winningest coach in school history who has been on the staff since 1975, and the head coach for 23 years in a job that gets probably five times the scrutiny as mayor of Easton.
And if what this group truly wants is a home run hire to replace Shiffert, can you even imagine being Tim Moncman looking at the Easton job, seeing how this all is being handled, and think "gee, I'd love to work there?"
Here is an article about the situation.
http://www.lehighvalleylive.com/opi...s_the_gripe_with_east.html#incart_river_index